Nightgame NOT Wiiware only!

Nicalis wants to make games for the Wii because Nintendo pays well.

They all get happy. I hate capitalism. T_T

i am indeed mad at nintendo, (though i must say i am not surprised.)
however, i think it's definitely premature to villainize Nicalis. It's not like they wanted exclusivity from the getgo. Nintendo convinced them to do it.

We don't know the details. maybe nintendo paid nicalis for a wii-only release, but maybe it was just in their contract that in order to be on the wii they couldn't be on PC, and in that case they would've had to choose 'wii or pc' and they can't really be blamed for choosing wii

(And also, we reeally should move this conversation to the 'night game' topic. i guess this makes me a hypocrite.)

World of Goo: Outstanding game. Released on WiiWare. Released on PC DRM-free. Why couldn't Night game too?

(And also, we reeally should move this conversation to the 'night game' topic. i guess this makes me a hypocrite.)

If you give it time, it will eventually find it's way back to the new game, but there isn't much to talk about in the first place, and at the moment so many people are sore about what has happened between Night Game and Nicalis that this hello kitty band-aid Nifflas has given us just isn't enough to stop the bleeding...

World of Goo: Outstanding game. Released on WiiWare. Released on PC DRM-free. Why couldn't Night game too?

I agree with this statement, and I quite frankly don't see why Nicalis/ Nintendo wouldn't.

Quote from: PONTO on March 01, 2009, 01:50:55

Nicalis wants to make games for the Wii because Nintendo pays well.

They all get happy. I hate capitalism. T_T

i am indeed mad at nintendo, (though i must say i am not surprised.)
however, i think it's definitely premature to villainize Nicalis. It's not like they wanted exclusivity from the getgo. Nintendo convinced them to do it.

We don't know the details. maybe nintendo paid nicalis for a wii-only release, but maybe it was just in their contract that in order to be on the wii they couldn't be on PC, and in that case they would've had to choose 'wii or pc' and they can't really be blamed for choosing wii

(And also, we reeally should move this conversation to the 'night game' topic. i guess this makes me a hypocrite.)

Nothing so far has suggested that Nintendo had any part in this decision, or explained why it wasn't announced until so close to the game's (probable) release. Then, of course, they didn't pressure 2Dboy into having WoG be Wii-only, unless that happened and I didn't hear about it.

Nothing so far has suggested that Nintendo had any part in this decision, or explained why it wasn't announced until so close to the game's (probable) release.

If Nintendo made no pressure, then Nicalis simply chose to do it and I'm even more mad at them. The PC version was ready, they just decided it wouldn't be published.

I can't help but see Nicalis as being predatory now. Night Game existed independently of, and previous to, Nicalis (the first NG post on the old forum is from September 2007, if I recall correctly; Nicalis was incorporated on November 29th 2007). Then, as detailed in that IGN article, Nicalis approached Nifflas and Chris Schlarb about a possible Wii version of Night Game in February 2008, and posted a call for developers for the Wii version in early March 2008. The agreement concerning the publishing of Night Game by Nicalis gives the rights to the game to Nicalis. Then, a year later, it comes out that the PC version of the game, which had previously been unquestionably expected to the public, is cancelled, although articles concerning the game up to the announcement all mention a PC version. The official Nicalis website assiduously avoids mention of platform, though the info on the IGF site explicitly shows a PC version.

Now, Nicalis is acting as if Night Game is just a Nicalis game and not a Nifflas game. The Nicalis site doesn't use the word "Nifflas" in its description of NG. The GoNintendo post revealing the trailer doesn't use the word "Nifflas" once, yet it explicitly thanks Nicalis, and Tyrone Rodriguez in particular. The Nintendo press release says "developed and published by Nicalis" without mentioning Nifflas, even though the game was in development before Nicalis existed. From the GoNintendo post: "First off, thanks to Mr. Rodriguez for sharing this trailer with us. It?s an honor to be the first ones to show off this upcoming WiiWare game." Screenshots of the game have been steadily leaked for over a year. This is not the first instance of NG being shown off.

Nicalis is going to have a hell of a time getting deals with indie developers if it acts like this.

I know I might be wrong about all of this. Maybe Nicalis really is a good thing. Maybe Nintendo is pressuring Nicalis to act like this. If I'm wrong, I'll be the first to point it out. But from where it stands now, Nicalis is looking really, really shady.

I hope that Nifflas can point Tyrone to this topic to see the impact of Nicalis' wrong decision.

I hope that Nifflas can point Tyrone to this topic to see the impact of Nicalis' wrong decision.

but as Googoogjoob said at the end, we don't really know who's decision it was. Goog is right that i shouldn't blame nintendo, but we don't really know nicalis's role either. maybe they were acting independently of nintendo, but i think it is more likely to be something they had to do in order to get to the wii.

And i also think that if it came down to an either/or decision (wii or PC), there's nothing wrong with choosing wii. Getting a game on the wii is a big opportunity for nifflas.

And i also think that if it came down to an either/or decision (wii or PC), there's nothing wrong with choosing wii. Getting a game on the wii is a big opportunity for nifflas.

It's wrong because all the fanbase was on the PC side. We were all expecting it to be on PC. Some of us ALSO have the Wii, but  even so, this announcement came to the great majority as sad news. That's what's wrong.

To develop a game for WiiWare, the developer has to buy this $2000 development kit thing, and get approved and licensed by Nintendo; Nintendo controls final prices for anything on WiiWare. Nintendo has extreme control over what happens on WiiWare. However, I sorta doubt that one of their conditions for licensing is platform exclusivity- again, World of Goo is a perfect example, since it's available on Windows, Mac, and Linux as well as Wii. It isn't implausible that Nintendo would ask for platform exclusivity, or at least platform restrictions, but it seems like the sort of thing they'd want to do with major developers, rather than a young publishing company like Nicalis, since the major developers' games would be more likely to sell more copies. (Even then, look at how many big-game-company games are available on competing platforms.)

But. The Wii exclusivity wasn't announced until just a few days ago, and you can find articles specifying that NG is to be PC and Wii dating from just a few weeks before. Nintendo would have the power to force this sort of decision, but to do it months after licensing a game seems unlikely. (Unless the Wii version started development two weeks ago, and was in development while negotiations over the license were going on. This seems extremely unlikely.)

That is to say, it isn't impossible that Nintendo made it be Wii-only, but then they'd have also forced Nicalis to keep up the ruse of a PC version for a year, which makes no sense at all.

I can't help but see Nicalis as being predatory now. Night Game existed independently of, and previous to, Nicalis (the first NG post on the old forum is from September 2007, if I recall correctly; Nicalis was incorporated on November 29th 2007). Then, as detailed in that IGN article, Nicalis approached Nifflas and Chris Schlarb about a possible Wii version of Night Game in February 2008, and posted a call for developers for the Wii version in early March 2008. The agreement concerning the publishing of Night Game by Nicalis gives the rights to the game to Nicalis. Then, a year later, it comes out that the PC version of the game, which had previously been unquestionably expected to the public, is cancelled, although articles concerning the game up to the announcement all mention a PC version. The official Nicalis website assiduously avoids mention of platform, though the info on the IGF site explicitly shows a PC version.

Now, Nicalis is acting as if Night Game is just a Nicalis game and not a Nifflas game. The Nicalis site doesn't use the word "Nifflas" in its description of NG. The GoNintendo post revealing the trailer doesn't use the word "Nifflas" once, yet it explicitly thanks Nicalis, and Tyrone Rodriguez in particular. The Nintendo press release says "developed and published by Nicalis" without mentioning Nifflas, even though the game was in development before Nicalis existed. From the GoNintendo post: "First off, thanks to Mr. Rodriguez for sharing this trailer with us. It?s an honor to be the first ones to show off this upcoming WiiWare game." Screenshots of the game have been steadily leaked for over a year. This is not the first instance of NG being shown off.

Nicalis is going to have a hell of a time getting deals with indie developers if it acts like this.

I know I might be wrong about all of this. Maybe Nicalis really is a good thing. Maybe Nintendo is pressuring Nicalis to act like this. If I'm wrong, I'll be the first to point it out. But from where it stands now, Nicalis is looking really, really shady.

As a son of two lawyers, I have plenty of resources for this.
If Nicalis does not introduce the game as a Nifflas game, the contract does not apply. The contract states that NIFFLAS' game will be
Wiiware only. But if it's not introduced as Nifflas, it isn't attached to him anymore, and neither is the contract.

Really, you can't put all the blame on Nicalis though. I have agreed that it's up to them to make decisions like these, and I'm ok with it. Nicalis have never kept me behind the light about the Wii exclusive discussions, and although I've said that my PC userbase have waited for this game and will be really disappointed if there's no PC release, I've also respected Nicalis' choises and not protested. This is still a great chance for me that I had to take, and even if I had known what I know now I'd do the same thing (although I would have told you earlier to not disappoint you).

Sure, it was not my choice, but that doesn't mean they totally outmaneuvered me. This is still an agreement with me and them!

I love working with Nicalis, and the people involved are a great bunch of people! They're not evil or anything. Also, do not blame them for that my name doesn't appear at gonintendo.com, Nicalis doesn't write the articles on that site. Believe me, they do recognize me as the author of the game.

Niclais is a company. Nifflas is a developer. Yes, it is unfortunate, but you can't fight it. This is the buisiness world people. Nifflas deserves to make money off of this game.

I am very happy for Nifflas. It is a HUGE achievement to get a wii ware title. Congrats Nifflas, you have my support, and so does Niclais.

And I don't want to be rude or anything, but you guys are being immature about this. I have a wii, but no Xbox or Ps#, do you think I was dissapointed when I found out I couldn't have CoD4 or GTA4??? I was, but I got over it. I don't know why you act like there is an injustice here. This is the game world as we know it. Things come out and are exclusive sometimes. How dare you be angry about this, instead of happy that Nifflas has become a successful developer. It is not right of you, Nifflas' own community, to not support his decissions. He needs this support and we should be the ones to give it.

Really, you can't put all the blame on Nicalis though. I have agreed that it's up to them to make decisions like these, and I'm ok with it. Nicalis have never kept me behind the light about the Wii exclusive discussions, and although I've said that my PC userbase have waited for this gane and will be really disappointed if there's no PC release, I've also respected Nicalis' choises and not protested. This is still a great chance for me that I had to take, and even if I had known what I know now I'd do the same thing (although I would have told you earlier to not disappoint you).

Sure, it was not my choice, but that doesn't mean they totally outmaneuvered me. This is still an agreement with me and them!

I love working with Nicalis, and the people involved are a great bunch of people! They're not evil or anything. Also, do not blame them for that my name doesn't appear at gonintendo.com, Nicalis doesn't write the articles on that site. Believe me, they do recognize me as the author of the game.

Still- why was the decision made, when was it made, and why was it announced so late?

Niclais is a company. Nifflas is a developer. Yes, it is unfortunate, but you can't fight it. This is the buisiness world people. Nifflas deserves to make money off of this game.

I think anyone deserves to make money off of what they've put effort into. I'm puzzled because I can't see how NG would make more money by being cut off from most of its premade fanbase.

Would you have paid money for the PC version in donations, even if it was a free download goog? Because most of us wouldn't