Knytt Stories Hall of Fame?

Is there...or should we create if there is not...a Knytt Stories MASTER LEVEL LIST or Hall of Fame for all the proven, tried, tested and truly master level KS games such as...

ColdMist Mountain

Shipwrecked

Dark Sky Over Wish Mountain

Gaia

Frozen Mountain

The Dying Core

Eurydice


etc, etc

maybe even start a new website just as a reference for all these great levels.

Levels that you would show to people who didn't know anything about KS and you wanted to introduce them to the best of the best of knytt stories. The reason you started playing...

Strictly 10 out of 10 games.

The biggest problem is that this is mostly opinion based, and there are a lot of great levels out there. With the Level archive that we're building, a rating system brings this up, and even then its still mostly opinion based.

The biggest problem is that this is mostly opinion based, and there are a lot of great levels out there. With the Level archive that we're building, a rating system brings this up, and even then its still mostly opinion based.

true. but wouldn't you say there's a difference between opinion and informed opinion?

After all the baseball hall of fame is basically an opinion vote itself.

if we have a judges panel of 10 KS experts decide - with a minimum 9 out of 10 voting rule for acceptance...

i mean, you tell me, i just think there should be some distinguishing award we could give to certain levels that are just...gone to that next level.

Quote from: LPChip on August 12, 2015, 21:40:34

The biggest problem is that this is mostly opinion based, and there are a lot of great levels out there. With the Level archive that we're building, a rating system brings this up, and even then its still mostly opinion based.

true. but wouldn't you say there's a difference between opinion and informed opinion?

After all the baseball hall of fame is basically an opinion vote itself.

if we have a judges panel of 10 KS experts decide - with a minimum 9 out of 10 voting rule for acceptance...

i mean, you tell me, i just think there should be some distinguishing award we could give to certain levels that are just...gone to that next level.

After trying to review levels in an objective manner, I realized that trying to sort them by overall greatness was a fool's task. The thing about the directory of KS levels is that they run the gambit from standard, to experimental, to WAAAY out there. If you tried to establish a single standard of quality, it would leave entire swaths of levels in the dark that might otherwise have been worth mentioning.

Personally speaking, if you truly want to be an authority on KS levels, you will have needed to have played ALL of them. That's the only way I could see someone being at all objective when they make a formal top 10 list.

Honestly, the best way to do it is with personal recommendations. We had a thread to that regard years ago, which you can find here, but let me hit you with my current subjective top 10. (Not including the Nifflas catalogue)

I agree that a list of the best is probably impossible, there are just too many weird and fascinating experimental levels. It would probably be possible to make a list of most of those, but since their value will vary from player to player most of them wouldn't be "strictly 10/10", in fact many of my favourites are unfinished levels that showcase the potential of the engine. You might even be better off just playing every level that looked halfway-appealing anyway.

I think my favourite level is Rainy Day Adventure, which is a weird choice since it has a lot of slow or rough portions, plus I worked on it myself. If I hadn't witnessed it develop, I'd probably be less affectionate towards it too, so my opinion is massively biased.

• 10 - sergiocornaga - Juni Jones: Ace Attorney

Oh wow. I'd love to know what I did in that level to earn that.

Quote from: Fubaka on August 13, 2015, 01:03:05

• 10 - sergiocornaga - Juni Jones: Ace Attorney

Oh wow. I'd love to know what I did in that level to earn that.

The answer to that is simple, but at the same time it isn't. I thought it was one of the most humorous KS levels I'd ever played, and I loved the way the music tied everything together. To me, it's the quintessential example of a glorious trainwreck. 

With the Level archive that we're building, a rating system brings this up, and even then its still mostly opinion based.

So this is still going to be released? I remember testing the beta a long time ago and it already seemed to be miles ahead of the current archive website, but it has been in development for so long! Knytt Stories has been out for like 8 years, so weird that you guys still find the motivation to work on that.

Hellooooo! 

So I don't know about a hall of fame with a SINGLE standard, but I can definitely see lists which encompass as many of the great levels as possible.  I really wish there was such a list, because sometimes when I download random knytt stories (hasn't happened in a LONG time though) I get... well... sorry, but crap.  Then you stumble upon gold, in one form or another (raw, granular, pure, or decorative if you ketch my drift) and BOOM! 

Thank you LP, Fubaka, Sergio, Raicu and HeadGrinder for your informed opinions on this subject. I basically agree with you all.

Maybe if there was a council of elders - who made this list and qualified it as an "informed opinion" type list and not the last word on anything. True - you wouldn't want to leave any worthy but obscure level in the dark - but the very purpose of these types of lists is curation. Just like a museum - where an informed, well-educated minority (a council if you will - in an art museum - liberal arts ph.d.'s, etc) serve as curator - telling the world at large - "this!" or "that!" is worthy of our attention. Having a select group of people like Talps, Sergio, LP, Fu, Ego, Healy et al qualify levels and all agree that these particular levels aren't just good...but GREAT and worthy of your time...to me - that would make a difference!

But anyway - thank you all for keeping KS alive and making spectacular levels that I to this day enjoy playing and replaying when I have time. Peace.

Even doing this would not work. You'll always step on someone's toes and that starts a discussion whether a level should be included or not, or perhaps even: someone thinking the selective group is not doing their work correctly and wants to join changing the balance.

No, for this to work, it must be based on everyone's opinion, which can be achieved by a proper rating system. The new archive will have this in the form of a review system. You answer a few questions and select each score, a rating is calculated based on that and its added to the total then an average rating is calculated.

It really is the best one can do, which is why such technique is used elsewhere as well.

...for this to work, it must be based on everyone's opinion, which can be achieved by a proper rating system. The new archive will have this in the form of a review system.

It really is the best one can do...

sounds good to me. looking forward to it!

I can't help but note that the two of my levels you mentioned in the post above are the two most in need of work; 'Eurydice' is old and pants and a remake of it is a project I'm very tempted to work on after 'Dragon Myth'. And 'Coldmist Mountain' is sorely in need of polish due to having been finished in a rush and published without any testing so as to meet an already-many-times-extended competition deadline. I keep telling myself I'll get around to fixing it one day...

Anyway, I guess this demonstrates the point that quality is subjective.

Welp, KS has surely been expanded since last time I was around. Oh, the glorious 2008 days of "Don't eat the mushroom" (anyone remember?)! Watching this new stuff, I am tempted for a reinstall