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General => Forum Games => Topic started by: Purple Pineapple on June 04, 2009, 07:05:28

Title: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: Purple Pineapple on June 04, 2009, 07:05:28
Kasran, townsperson, killed night 3

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.
Spoiler: Actions summary (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign up
Post by: koromi on June 04, 2009, 07:06:53
yep.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign up
Post by: Bored2death on June 04, 2009, 07:13:58
I would like to sign up!
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign up
Post by: Budja on June 04, 2009, 07:16:55
sign me up
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign up
Post by: LimeLemon on June 04, 2009, 08:44:40
Signing up!
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign up
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 04, 2009, 11:45:46
Yup.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign up
Post by: Salmoneous on June 04, 2009, 12:40:58
I want to be in!
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign up
Post by: Dataflashsabot on June 04, 2009, 12:45:17
Sign me up.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign up
Post by: Shawnachu on June 04, 2009, 14:40:28
Count me in.  ;)
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign up
Post by: Igiari on June 04, 2009, 15:30:40
I want to join! o/
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign up
Post by: Kasran on June 04, 2009, 15:50:37
Perhaps I'll join this round.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign up
Post by: Razzorman on June 04, 2009, 16:14:55
I'd like to join.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign up
Post by: Firecat on June 04, 2009, 20:17:41
I will join
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign-up
Post by: Purple Pineapple on June 05, 2009, 00:04:09
That's 11 players. Anyone else has exactly one day (until 6/4/09 24:00:00) to sign up.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign up
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 05, 2009, 00:22:23
*pile drives the sign in sheet*
I'm as good as in.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign up
Post by: TechnoGeek on June 05, 2009, 00:46:13
i'm in.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Sign up
Post by: Purple Pineapple on June 05, 2009, 02:47:13
*bump* (Not that this really needs one X)) Slightly changed SK.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Confirm
Post by: Purple Pineapple on June 05, 2009, 06:40:33
Oh. Looks like the sign-up's done. *sending PMs* Please confirm in thread or by PM.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Confirm
Post by: Razzorman on June 05, 2009, 08:04:15
I got the PM. I confirm.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Confirm
Post by: Budja on June 05, 2009, 08:32:17
/confirm
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Confirm
Post by: Dataflashsabot on June 05, 2009, 11:17:08
I does confirm indeed.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Confirm
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 05, 2009, 12:25:06
confirm
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Confirm
Post by: LimeLemon on June 05, 2009, 14:49:41
Confirming.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Confirm
Post by: Kasran on June 05, 2009, 15:18:37
I confirm that I have received the personal message in which I was assigned my role.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Confirm
Post by: Bored2death on June 05, 2009, 15:40:57
Confirming
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Confirm
Post by: TechnoGeek on June 05, 2009, 16:27:25
I have received my PM and confirm my role in this game of Mafia.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Confirm
Post by: Firecat on June 05, 2009, 19:09:16
Confirmed the role.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Confirm
Post by: Shawnachu on June 06, 2009, 00:05:04
Confirmed.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Confirm
Post by: Igiari on June 06, 2009, 00:06:13
Cinformed!
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Purple Pineapple on June 06, 2009, 21:45:18
Just fyi, the special roles were assigned by double draw from a deck of cards :) . e.g. pull cards until two of a kind. A = koromi, K = t3c4n0g33k

EDIT: My bad. Didn't see koromi's PM. Anyway.

Day 1

The sun rose over a small town in the valley. Everyone slowly dragged themselves out of bed to congregate at the meeting hall. After half an hour, when the mayor hadn't shown up, someone went to look for him. Before long, the news got out: the mayor was dead; the mafia was at large.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 06, 2009, 23:19:10
Whoop de doo.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: LimeLemon on June 06, 2009, 23:56:53
Yay random voting time! -.-
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Shawnachu on June 07, 2009, 00:43:44
Seriously, there really is no intellectual way to vote on the first day.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 07, 2009, 03:14:44
Right just one thing first
Before lynching, we ask for a claim. This helps us to avoid lynching investigators, other PRs.

@shawn, why not? What information is specifically needed?

vote: korimi

Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: koromi on June 07, 2009, 03:33:29
how about a reason to lynch, budja?
i won't vote for you out of revenge, but please. explain that vote.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 07, 2009, 04:04:44
I looked at the player list and picked a name at random :P.

I don't want a quick, random lynch but random votes are fine at this stage.

Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: koromi on June 07, 2009, 07:01:00
I looked at the player list and picked a name at random :P.

I don't want a quick, random lynch but random votes are fine at this stage.



it seems pretty unfair to me that i could be lynched simply because i was chosen randomly.
..and it seems suspicious to me that you seem not to care who is lynched. anyone could have been chosen at random, like a townsperson with a special role. for this reason, i am placing my finger of suspicion on budja.

(and if you're going to attempt to pointlessly lynch me, please spell my name correctly <_<)
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 07, 2009, 08:39:56
Hmm, ok then, unvote, vote koromi.

Quote from: Budja
I don't want a quick, random lynch

Read more carefully, I am not trying to pointlessly lynch anyone. The easiest way to provoke discussion IMO is to place a vote.

Your reaction to one vote here is a little extreme.

Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: LimeLemon on June 07, 2009, 13:21:40
The easiest way to provoke discussion IMO is to place a vote.

Well, there must  be some other, better ways...
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Salmoneous on June 07, 2009, 14:27:14
I said I wanted to be in on first page.
Confirm.
blah.

confirmed!
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Salmoneous on June 07, 2009, 14:37:13
No wait. I dont want to be in.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 07, 2009, 14:47:43
Elder, please refrain from dual posting...  It's like trying to dual wield refrigerators:  It won't work out in your favor.

On topic:  I hate to say it, but the reaction from one vote being extreme must be some unusual omen...  I doubt anyone wants me to roleclaim at all, as I'm pretty sure people know from my mafia gaming history who I wind up being 99% of the time...  As for voting, I've nobody to suspect really.  Not even Budja arises my suspicion a whole lot.  Can't really vote until I have more reactions.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Shawnachu on June 07, 2009, 17:08:25
@shawn, why not? What information is specifically needed?

There's no way to tell who someone is on the first day. You'd need a voting pattern that points at that person being a night role, and even then you can't be sure.

Anyway, I'll randomly vote Dataflashsabot.

Because I can and it's free.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Dataflashsabot on June 07, 2009, 17:39:27
I'll randomly vote NESgamer190.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Purple Pineapple on June 07, 2009, 19:27:02
I said I wanted to be in on first page.
Confirm.
blah.

confirmed!
Damn. I am not doing very well hosting this.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Salmoneous on June 07, 2009, 19:49:50
I vote: Budja
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 07, 2009, 21:16:07
Data, why the vote for me besides random?  Dost thou showeth no trust toward me?
 :huh:
As for votes, I've still no vote verdict yet.  I would vote dataflash, but that would be conceived as a scummy act and will wind up hindering the town in the end.  (still no vote, as I've no hard evidence still, aside from my history of mafia gaming.)
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 07, 2009, 21:54:51
Absolutely no clue who to vote ;)... I'll just wait and see what happens. No FOS, yet, either, and nobody seems to have incriminating evidence yet...
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: TechnoGeek on June 07, 2009, 23:09:45
Absolutely no clue who to vote ;)... I'll just wait and see what happens. No FOS, yet, either, and nobody seems to have incriminating evidence yet...
I think i'll do the same...
and what do you mean by claims, budja?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Purple Pineapple on June 07, 2009, 23:46:43
No wait. I dont want to be in.
I vote: Budja
Wait. Is Salmoneous in?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: LimeLemon on June 08, 2009, 00:26:05
All these random votes... we can just commit suicide instead.
Vote:LimeLemon
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 08, 2009, 02:42:26
By claim I mean that if a power role (eg. investigator) is about to be lynched they can tell us so we don't actually lynch them.

NES seems to be afraid of appearing scummy which is slightly scummy in itself.
unvote, vote NESGamer
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 08, 2009, 03:10:27
Budja...  Not to be cruel, but I am speaking the truth.  Let's be honest.  out of history, I don't think I was ever mafia.  Granted it doesn't mean people will think of me as innocent, but I seem to notice a trend.
I've about reached a verdict, not in self defense, but out of self thought, but alas, to vote budja, or the other person voting me (who happen to be the ONLY voters), would guarantee my death, so to try and procure other information, I'm going to have to blindly vote T3c4n0g33k.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 08, 2009, 03:19:41
Budja...  Not to be cruel, but I am speaking the truth.  Let's be honest.  out of history, I don't think I was ever mafia.  Granted it doesn't mean people will think of me as innocent, but I seem to notice a trend.
I've about reached a verdict, not in self defense, but out of self thought, but alas, to vote budja, or the other person voting me (who happen to be the ONLY voters), would guarantee my death, so to try and procure other information, I'm going to have to blindly vote T3c4n0g33k.


You seem to really be trying to defend yourself there. Plus, it seems you feel guaranteed that you are going to die, it's only a matter of time. By implying everybody should be voting, it seems to indicate you want somebody lynched. My question is, do you want a townsperson or a mafia? Or do you want everyone but you dead? No, I'm afraid I'm going to Vote: NESgamer190.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 08, 2009, 03:57:17
Aye, you've left me but no choice but to give you my final two warnings to thee before thou all maketh fatal moves.
Firstly, you should learn that those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it,
and secondly, I will roleclaim if thou desire it, in fact...  I am but a mere townsperson again.  Failure to heed this final warning will give the mafia a head start in repeating history (Translation: a victory for mafia will occur if I wind up hung).  *pulls out cyanide if it comes to his death sentence*
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 08, 2009, 04:17:16
Budja...  Not to be cruel, but I am speaking the truth.  Let's be honest.  out of history, I don't think I was ever mafia.  Granted it doesn't mean people will think of me as innocent, but I seem to notice a trend.
I've about reached a verdict, not in self defense, but out of self thought, but alas, to vote budja, or the other person voting me (who happen to be the ONLY voters), would guarantee my death, so to try and procure other information, I'm going to have to blindly vote T3c4n0g33k.

You lie... the old forum, Mafia 5.0. You were Sofia 3, a mafia member. I now see no reason to trust you.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 08, 2009, 04:39:22
OK

1. You claim your role with 2 votes?! Why? Its 7 to lynch by the number of players. You are nowhere near a lynch.
2. You have been town before. So what. Probability doesn't work that way. You have the same chance of being mafia as anyone else.
3. Saying you am town means ... well nothing really. Why should I believe you simply at your word.

Keep that defeatist attitude and you can only harm the town. If you are not scum then who is a better target?

@mod, if you sent Salmoneous a role, then he is in the game, if you didn't, then he can't be as it would be obvious to us that he would have to be a townie and not scum.

@shawn, talk on day 1 leads to more information for the town. More information = greater chance of town victory.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: koromi on June 08, 2009, 07:47:31
can everyone just calm down and stop voting.
if you just stop and read, there's almost enough information for a sensible vote in what some people have said. 
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Salmoneous on June 08, 2009, 08:03:10
Wait. Is Salmoneous in?

That sounds like a mafia. I vote: Purple Pineapple!
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: koromi on June 08, 2009, 08:44:34
purple pineapple is not playing.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Kasran on June 08, 2009, 15:02:06
Good job, Salmon; Purple Pineapple is the mediator for the game. XD

Anyway, I am downright amazed that I haven't gotten lynched yet.
(...oh wait. there hasn't been a real night yet. Dammit.)

Anyway. NESgamer does indeed sound awfully suspicious, so vote NESgamer190.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Razzorman on June 08, 2009, 15:50:03
Budja...  Not to be cruel, but I am speaking the truth.  Let's be honest.  out of history, I don't think I was ever mafia.  Granted it doesn't mean people will think of me as innocent, but I seem to notice a trend.
I've about reached a verdict, not in self defense, but out of self thought, but alas, to vote budja, or the other person voting me (who happen to be the ONLY voters), would guarantee my death, so to try and procure other information, I'm going to have to blindly vote T3c4n0g33k.


You seem to really be trying to defend yourself there. Plus, it seems you feel guaranteed that you are going to die, it's only a matter of time. By implying everybody should be voting, it seems to indicate you want somebody lynched. My question is, do you want a townsperson or a mafia? Or do you want everyone but you dead? No, I'm afraid I'm going to Vote: NESgamer190.
I don't get it. First you criticize NES for pushing for a lynch, (which he never really did, by the way) then you immediately start pushing to lynch him?
That seems at least a little bit suspicious to me.
I vote: Bored2death.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Shawnachu on June 08, 2009, 15:53:53
@shawn, talk on day 1 leads to more information for the town. More information = greater chance of town victory.

Yes, I can see your point there.

I'm going to unvote: Dataflashsabot and vote:NESgamer. He seriously looks like he is trying to defend himself.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 08, 2009, 16:23:08
So you are voting NES for defending himself? Is that really a bad thing?

unvote for now. I really don't want a lynch yet.

Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: LimeLemon on June 08, 2009, 17:31:22
I agree that NESgamer seems suspicious.
Vote:NESgamer190
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 08, 2009, 17:49:51
Budja...  Not to be cruel, but I am speaking the truth.  Let's be honest.  out of history, I don't think I was ever mafia.  Granted it doesn't mean people will think of me as innocent, but I seem to notice a trend.
I've about reached a verdict, not in self defense, but out of self thought, but alas, to vote budja, or the other person voting me (who happen to be the ONLY voters), would guarantee my death, so to try and procure other information, I'm going to have to blindly vote T3c4n0g33k.


You seem to really be trying to defend yourself there. Plus, it seems you feel guaranteed that you are going to die, it's only a matter of time. By implying everybody should be voting, it seems to indicate you want somebody lynched. My question is, do you want a townsperson or a mafia? Or do you want everyone but you dead? No, I'm afraid I'm going to Vote: NESgamer190.
I don't get it. First you criticize NES for pushing for a lynch, (which he never really did, by the way) then you immediately start pushing to lynch him?
That seems at least a little bit suspicious to me.
I vote: Bored2death.

In explanation, I believe that NES is hiding something, and he also voted randomly (which is kind of ok on the first day, but will get us nowhere), showing that he doesn't really care who dies. Most other people, including yourself, waited for some evidence. He has not. Plus, if you see above replies, he lied. He was a mafia member in mafia 5.0, in the old forum. I did a little bit of research there to see if he could be trusted. He said that he doesn't think he was ever a mafia. That is a lie. Anyway, he just seems suspicious, and I'd rather nail a mafia day one than try to day 4, when everyone's gone, because by that time, it's to late... we're dead in the night, and they win. Also, just as a side note, for all anyone knows yet, you could be a mafia member, as well, and are trying to cover for your partner by voting one of the more outspoken members against him.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 08, 2009, 18:03:07
Sorry for inactivity. Wont be able to post for more than 12 hours.  :/
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: TechnoGeek on June 08, 2009, 20:49:53
Based on current evidence above, I also vote: NESGamer
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 08, 2009, 21:04:01
Either counted wrong, or the town just doomed itself.
Soulless people never know how sensitive I can be with skewers.  Looks like I be seeing death...  As Abraham Lincoln once said, "I never told a lie."  But alas, nobody trusts a wretch...  *drops cyanide, pulls out a lighter and lights his lace on fire*  Any last words before the verdict of my death?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 08, 2009, 21:34:53
I only see 6 votes (Budja took his off)... you might still be alive, for now...and you are still over-defending yourself. Even if you are as you claim, one deceased townie (which I pray you are not, because it would hurt the town) would not necessarily mean the end of the game for all of us. And, again, you stubbornly insist that you have not lied. You were Sofia the third, in Mafia version 5.0, in the old forum. This contradicts what you say when you said you never were a mafia member. Looking on the history of mafia can lead to resolving the problems in the future. In addition to this reason, even though you said, after two votes, that it was cruel and unfair, you still then when and voted randomly, which would also be cruel and unfair.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 08, 2009, 23:09:47
Although I haven't followed the conversation at all, one should never rely on past mafia games to from a basis of any syllogism. Just saying.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 09, 2009, 00:02:05
If you read the rest of it, you might understand.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 09, 2009, 02:17:44
TechnoGeek and Limelemon joined the end of the NES wagon without any comment. FoS. What do you two actually think of NES?

Random votes at the very start of the game are not suspicious and are actually a good way of getting the game moving. Simply waiting for evidence doesn't work.

The case of NES is not that strong but was a good way to begin. I think everyone should at least check in and voice an opinion before we lynch anyone.

NES, do you have anything to say apart from dramatically declaring doom and generally having a death-wish. NES's death-wish suggests to me that he is not scum but it is still anti-town.

@mod, votecount please.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 09, 2009, 03:25:31
Budja.  I'm going to say that you're going to have to follow your gut with the TechnoGeek voting me, as I might be feeling he done this against me in a potential revenge vote instead of circumstantial evidence.  (I voted him first out of trying to find out information, and he claims to vote me for the "above evidence".
I will keep my vote upon techno just due to the potential possibility of revenge voting.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 09, 2009, 03:52:31
You are irrationally paranoid about revenge votes.

A town player has no do so out of annoyance but it isn't helpful.
A mafia player may vote their attacker in order to discredit them.

TechnoGeek is currently under no real threat of a lynch and would have no reason to revenge vote you. I was more potentially concerned with some votes on the NES wagon being opportunistic.

Your logic fails here, NES.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: LimeLemon on June 09, 2009, 08:43:21
TechnoGeek and Limelemon joined the end of the NES wagon without any comment. FoS. What do you two actually think of NES?

I said I agreed with the above posts, that NES was overdefending, suspicous etc. I had nothing to say that not already had been said.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 09, 2009, 12:17:45
On Koromi:
it seems pretty unfair to me that i could be lynched simply because i was chosen randomly.
One vote and Koromi mentions future possible lynches of him? Quaint.

..and it seems suspicious to me that you seem not to care who is lynched.
Random baseless statement, I think.
Generally, words like 'seem' and 'could be' water down the suspiciousness of these posts, so... nothing doing with Koromi.

On NES:

I doubt anyone wants me to roleclaim at all, as I'm pretty sure people know from my mafia gaming history who I wind up being 99% of the time...
False probability syllogism. Your role in this game does not hinge on the role you had during previous mafia games. You have chosen, in this post, a peculiar line of defense which fails easily. Why did you choose to point out to use that you have usually were an innocent (regardless if you were or not, I'm not bothered to check)? Why such a desperate defense?

Aye, you've left me but no choice but to give you my final two warnings to thee before thou all maketh fatal moves.
Firstly, you should learn that those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it,
and secondly, I will roleclaim if thou desire it, in fact...  I am but a mere townsperson again.  Failure to heed this final warning will give the mafia a head start in repeating history (Translation: a victory for mafia will occur if I wind up hung).  *pulls out cyanide if it comes to his death sentence*

Speaking about this game, at least: Why all this melodrama? Tactically, NESGamer, you are horribly inept. Subterfuge and subtlety seems to elude you. Why? Why are you so inherently paranoid, overprotective of yourself and also so pessimistic? 7 votes weren't so close when you started going all crazy arse. :P

On Shawn:
There's no way to tell who someone is on the first day. You'd need a voting pattern that points at that person being a night role, and even then you can't be sure.
Well. Behaviour in the thread, stumbles a mafia makes, jumping on bandwagons but never making a proper case against suspects... all these things could help weed out a mafia player during the first day.
It is unwise to dismiss Day 1 as inevitably futile, based on the assertion that mafia can be found only randomly on Day 1. Also remember, that even if we do lynch a townie, Day 1 can give all sorts of background information about players, their actions, the way they react. Of course, this knowledge can be implemented all the better Day 2 and later, but Day 1 is by no means futile, if you are insinuating it is.

On Bored:
By implying everybody should be voting, it seems to indicate you want somebody lynched.
An interesting post. Where does NESGamer imply everybody should be voting?
Your vote (which you place a little later on in the same post) looks like it is based (at least partly) on NESgamers indication he's desperate for a lynch. I don't really see this desperation. All I see is a paranoid NES who is most probably some kind of power role, and has become entirely oversensitive due having this role.

Even if you are as you claim, one deceased townie (which I pray you are not, because it would hurt the town) would not necessarily mean the end of the game for all of us.
One should attempt to completely exclude the chance of NES being a townie before voting for him, no? You seem not entirely sure with your vote on NES. Is this the case?

Looking on the history of mafia can lead to resolving the problems in the future.

Indeed. Looking at the general game behaviour all the players display, in an effort to promote better ways of playing, such as openness and conversation rather than lynching randomly and relying on night powers is very wise.
However, one cannot come to a conclusion on a specific player based on, for example, one's change in behaviour from one game to the next.
I see now that your argument was based on NESGamer's lie (which I may talk about later) rather than on his past roles.


As a general note to everybody, I would like to encourage you to ask before voting. One can understand a lot about one's opinions and stances by asking. Furthermore, a question doesn't necessarily have to have good motives! A question could be aimed at a suspect to try and make them contradict themselves or a potential mafia to force them into making mistakes. The most basic question in mafia, from which nearly all other questions stem is: "What do you think about this?".
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Kasran on June 09, 2009, 13:05:59
I would like to unvote, please. :/
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 09, 2009, 13:29:01
Quote from: Lunar
Well. Behaviour in the thread, stumbles a mafia makes, jumping on bandwagons but never making a proper case against suspects... all these things could help weed out a mafia player during the first day.

The problem here is that townies are doing the same thing. Look at the current NES wagon.

It really does help the town if you add an explanation when you vote (preferably something more substantional than "I agree with X").

Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Razzorman on June 09, 2009, 14:50:11
So Lunar, who do you think is the most likely to be mafia?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 09, 2009, 16:32:11
So Lunar, who do you think is the most likely to be mafia?
I'd be defying my own laws of mediocrity by voting, but I will say that if I were pushed (with hot iron forks) to vote I would be 35% happy with my vote being on the least inactive player, who in this case would be either Technogeek, Kasran or Salmoneous (I haven't checked yet so I couldn't say for sure).

I would be 10% happy with a Bored2death vote.

I feel that at this point lynching NESgamer is a gamble. I am almost certain that NESgamer is not a vanilla role (so he's either a seer, or a mafia, or a SK or something).
And if he is a vanilla role, he is seriously farking with our heads with this strange behaviour of his.

'Tis early days yet Razzor.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 09, 2009, 18:37:21
I'll unvote as well, unless I see further cause to pursue voting.

Thanks for helping me see the error of my ways... though, it seems a little rash to point the FOS at the least active members. Last time we tried that, it turned out to be the investigator. Just because they aren't entering the voting stage yet doesn't mean they are mafia. Waiting for evidence can be good, something I kind of rushed a little :oops:. However, note NESgamer's claim (which he made after 2 votes)... he claims he is  a townie, which doesn't fit in with where you tried to place him. So, either you're wrong, and he is a vanilla, or you're right, and he is lying to us. I shall wait now to see if I can make a better vote. Also, for all we know, you could be specifically defending him for a reason........... now, it could be an innocent reason, or one that could potentially harm the town. We shall wait and see.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: TechnoGeek on June 09, 2009, 21:29:11
I voted for NESGamer because so far, he seems the most suspicious.  All of this arguing back-and-forth and general confusion may be what he wants if he is a mafia member.  However, if he is a townie, it it all pointless to do so as of yet.  By arguing about why not to vote him in the way that he is, he is only drawing suspicion to himself.  Again, it makes the most sense to me if he is mafia.
I still have my vote on NESGamer.

Another thing I would like to mention is that I only check the forum once a day or so, so voting me based on activity seems totally pointless to me because others could be in a similar situation.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 09, 2009, 21:45:45
Well, I'm not going to lynch him without more reasons, though he has my FOS.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 10, 2009, 11:14:25
On Techno:
I voted for NESGamer because so far, he seems the most suspicious.
It makes sense to me that investigators act suspiciously, as do doctors and generally all non vanilla town roles are likely to act suspiciously. All I am pointing out is that while there's something going on with NESgamer, his roleclaim being the culmination of this suspicious behaviour, this said behaviour by no means necessarily equates to scummyness.

Again, it makes the most sense to me if he is mafia.
Could you elaborate on this? I'd like to know, other than the things you have already posted, what makes you think this.

Another thing I would like to mention is that I only check the forum once a day or so, so voting me based on activity seems totally pointless to me because others could be in a similar situation.
It is by no means pointless. In a (very unreal) situation where one has to choose between an inactive person and an active person, it makes complete sense to vote out the inactive person, as he is the least beneficial to the town. Of course, this theoretical situation shouldn't be applied, but it definitely isn't pointless to (given no other path of action) place one's vote due to a player's activity, or lack thereof.


On Bored:
I'll unvote as well, unless I see further cause to pursue voting.
Your open-mindedness and non-stubbornness impresses me. As producing flattery escapes me, I shall only say that you smell pro-town. Only if I wanted to throw you in the most scummiest of lights would I accuse you being scummy due to the boustrophedon turn of your opinions.
But I am forced to do this for the sake of the town, so I ask: Your speed to drop your vote can be explained with the following scenarios: a ) either you were never sure of your vote in the first place in which case one may accuse you of hasty, rash voting and of wanting a lynch too much, b ) you dropped your vote because you smelled an upstart townie get in your way and are doing your best to look pro-town, in which case one can accuse you of being a town-pretending scum, or c ). Find c. :P
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 10, 2009, 17:02:59
I dropped it because, after all, it is the first day, and we have no hard evidence, other than one past lie. It is obvious that NES has some kind of power role, but we don't know what kind yet. This is my first time playing, but I can understand if NES has a power role and wants to stay alive, that's fine, as long as it benefits the town. If evidence shows up to the contrary, then I will vote for him. Right now, all he has is my FOS. People get way to suspicious on this game, and they don't trust the others (the whole point of the game). The only way for the town to win is if we can learn to trust each other enough to locate the mafia and sk and get them out of here. If none of us trust each other, we'll all just randomly point fingers, and it's possible the investigator, doctor, or another townie may get lynched because of it. However, I do not believe that NES is the investigator, he's to active to be that. The investigator is probably waiting till nightfall to ask about someone like NES, or one of the other suspicious members. Right now, I'd say that the investigator is either Technogeek, Kasran, or Salmoneous, and the others may or may not be anti-town roles. However, note that it would be more beneficial to a mafia member, I think, if they could be actively lynching people as well, so I don't think any of them are mafia. Anyway, the first day is made of hasty, rash votes, which I participated in for a bit, but lynching someone without enough evidence will get us nowhere, almost certainly, and NES was almost actually lynched. After reconsidering his case, I decided to unvote. I hold no grudges nor unfair votes, but if NES should continue to act suspicious, then I shall be forced to vote for him, in order to protect the town. If only night came and the investigator could investigate him... of course, then again, we don't know who the investigator is, so we don't know who to trust. I hope this is a satisfactory explanation of my quick change. Scum life is not the life for me.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Razzorman on June 10, 2009, 17:20:50
I unvote, for some pretty obvious reasons.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 10, 2009, 19:36:40
Mod, could you put the vote count in your first post? Thanks, it'd be greatly appreciated.

Anyway, wanted to ask if the investigator would, if they found the mafia, reveal themselves to the public to let us know. Hopefully, no one will make false claims, however. I have nothing more to add right now, and have found no new evidence about any suspicious actions. I'm wondering when day 1 will end, however... i fear the night!
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 10, 2009, 21:03:28
@bored2death's post on 16:02:59:
Well, I can safely say that investigator theory is plausible.  As for voting, I might as well unvote if what the post at the time was proves true.  It's just a theory, but better than savagery in my view, which almost led to my death.  I'm simply glad to see that logic has come through to the people, and for that, I am going to be grateful for.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 10, 2009, 21:43:45
On NES
NESGamer, you haven't left my scrutiny, and I daresay the town's as well. You still have to explain your erratic and positively untownlike actions. Avoiding to do so even after you have 'gotten away with it' hints more to uncaring and indifferent scum rather than open and talkative seer or baner. I'd also like to know who you view as scum.

On Razzor
I unvote, for some pretty obvious reasons.
Are we to take it that you agree completely with Bored's statement?
It is not helpful to the town to leave such matters unexplained Razzor, please elaborate.

On the Town:
It's been one and a half days with the conversation between me, bored and NES.
It would be very interesting to hear the town's opinions on NES' actions before and after his near lynch experience, Bored's sudden change of heart and the theory that at the moment were better off just lynching the least active.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Razzorman on June 10, 2009, 22:27:16
On Razzor
I unvote, for some pretty obvious reasons.
Are we to take it that you agree completely with Bored's statement?
It is not helpful to the town to leave such matters unexplained Razzor, please elaborate.
My vote on Bored was mostly based on the fact that he was pushing very hard for a quick lynch on NES, with a false argument.
When he unvoted NES I couldn't be sure that he was mafia anymore, since he had suddenly stopped pushing for a lynch.

Of course, he could still be mafia, and simply unvoted because he felt he was under pressure. That is just speculation though, and its nothing I want to base my vote on.

Edit: Also, what happened to igiari and firecat? They haven't said a single word, other than the mandatory confirmation post. Can I have an explanation for this please?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 10, 2009, 22:34:58
@Lunar:  So far, I've found nobody discriminatingly scummy, considering the logic of Bored2death's theory pulls techno out of the radar of sorts.  (Translation:  I can't seem to find anyone scummy enough to get the vote yet, so until a verdict comes, I might have to hold off from voting a bit until a new verdict comes.)
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 11, 2009, 00:04:02
Now, not to push hard or anything, but... we've asked for an explanation, and you have failed to deliver, thus far. I agree with Lunar, you are under scrutiny. Explain your actions soon, or the town may decide matters are better decided without you there. You are being overly evasive, and if you had a pro-town role, wouldn't you explain your actions? If you don't explain them soon, I and some others may see fit to vote to lynch you. I'd hate to make a fairly quick decision, but your actions thus far have not exactly been... normal.  Now, I have also been wondering what happened to Igiari and Firecat...although I can understand if they don't want to make a rash decision, they haven't said a single word... they could be partners in a sinister plan, but we can't be sure, as they might not have been able to make it to a computer recently, either.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 11, 2009, 00:22:20
Well bored2death, thanks for the reminder...
To be honest, I've been a bit sensitive like my family has been in real life, so the defensive bit comes there, but my paranoia literally brewed out of my own fears.  (In other words, it was out of natural reaction.)
Forgive me if that's not a high enough explanation, but I have to say that man can either be prey (in my case.), civil, or savage predator.  I promise to man up a little more for the future.  I assure that or death by ice I get.  All in all, I was worried that people would be rash to speedkill me.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 11, 2009, 00:25:30
Fair enough, but one other question comes to mind there: in the history of Mafia gaming, nothing like this has occurred before in your situation. Why is that, and why is it just this time that you are basically exploding about small things?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 11, 2009, 00:43:16
Fair enough, but one other question comes to mind there: in the history of Mafia gaming, nothing like this has occurred before in your situation. Why is that, and why is it just this time that you are basically exploding about small things?
My family's called me a worrywart, and I guess they were right.  My paranoia makes me an all too worrisome individual, especially near insects.  All in all, my paranoia winds up highjacking my seat of control whenever something disastrous comes.  I guess you can call it a weakness of mine, but As I mentioned before, I'm going to man up to my paranoia.  (apologies about same reason utilization, but needless to say, I've been a worrywart to cause me to go into doomsday mode.)
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 11, 2009, 00:44:21
Yet... you avoid another question? Again: why is this behavior seen now, but not in the past? I don't mean to come across as cruel or tough, but if that's the case, the reason is to get as much evidence as possible for the good of the town. Your actions still haven't been satisfactorily explained.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 11, 2009, 01:06:59
Yet... you avoid another question? Again: why is this behavior seen now, but not in the past? I don't mean to come across as cruel or tough, but if that's the case, the reason is to get as much evidence as possible for the good of the town. Your actions still haven't been satisfactorily explained.
I figure I might as well explain the whole reason of a fearful bout.  Needless to say, Consider this very macabre, but the fact I have final exams, as well as the fact of my pitiful trigonometry skills are existent, caused me some unneeded distress.  In earlier rounds, I've either been untouched by votes, or I was not quite taking trigonometry's harder segment/nearing finals.  Forgive me if this STILL is not enough to explain my jittery actions, but stress is by and far my big panic causer.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 11, 2009, 01:20:25
I guess... I wouldn't know the feeling. I'm in middle school, we don't have to take finals. I can imagine, however, the stress you felt. Hope you did well!

@mod: how long is day one going to last? we need some kind of action around here... it's beginning to get... must I say it... (points to name) :sigh: boring... yep, the grim reaper's coming for me...
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Purple Pineapple on June 11, 2009, 01:44:00
@mod: how long is day one going to last? we need some kind of action around here... it's beginning to get... must I say it... (points to name) :sigh: boring... yep, the grim reaper's coming for me...
If neccessary, I can say everyone turned around and went to bed. With 13 alive, it takes 7 to quit. :P
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 11, 2009, 01:48:52
We'll see if everyone's still awake, first! Or, if anyone else is alive (has stuff been going on that I was left out on :shocked:? Everyone's dead... all my town friends...  :sad: that's why they stopped replying... uh-oh... I'm the mafia's next target!
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 11, 2009, 03:18:27
Quote from: Razzorman
My vote on Bored was mostly based on the fact that he was pushing very hard for a quick lynch on NES, with a false argument.
When he unvoted NES I couldn't be sure that he was mafia anymore, since he had suddenly stopped pushing for a lynch.

Of course, he could still be mafia, and simply unvoted because he felt he was under pressure. That is just speculation though, and its nothing I want to base my vote on.

Yes, but I think he unvote was largly influenced by Lunar here.

FoS: Lunar, Bored2Death for role-fishing, Lunar at least should know better.
Seriously how many times do you want to mention that NES probably has a PR.
Even if you suspect as much, you don't have to declare it to the whole town.

vote: Lunar for reasons above.

I am not keen on a lurker lynch currently. Igiari is a chronic lurker in all games anyway. Some prods would be good though.

NES's use of language seems still slightly forced. I have never seen NES speak in such prose before.

@mod, could we have a votecount and could we have some prods on the inactives (i.e PM inactives).

Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 11, 2009, 03:48:32
Are you suggesting that looking for solid evidence before voting is a bad thing? That's the way it comes out to me, and I just cannot follow that advice with a good conscience. And, just so you know, my mind is open, it isn't focused on NES. He currently seems the most suspicious to me, but then again, he may have his reasons for keeping us in the dark.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Purple Pineapple on June 11, 2009, 03:51:44
Votecount:

NESgamer190 (4): Dataflashsabot, shawnachu, LimeLemon, TechnoGeek
Lunar_Tick (1): Budja

Inactives prodded.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Dataflashsabot on June 11, 2009, 13:35:47
oops, sorry for being inactive... I've been keeping up with this thread, just didn't have anything to contribute that hadn't already been said :/
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Razzorman on June 11, 2009, 14:46:16
Are you suggesting that looking for solid evidence before voting is a bad thing? That's the way it comes out to me, and I just cannot follow that advice with a good conscience.
There isn't much solid evidence that can be gathered in the first day. In the end, we will all have to base our votes on some amount of speculation. How much you want to guess on is completely up to yourself.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Firecat on June 11, 2009, 17:38:43
Well, i dont know who to vote, even more, im kinda lost  :sick: we have to beware, the last round we lnych too many good roles.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 12, 2009, 06:36:33
It's obvious nobody else is doing anything. To get this going, I'll vote for the most suspicious person to date. I really don't want this game to die... so, here's my vote:
Vote: NESgamer190
Reasons are explained above, in previous posts. I can understand the stress thing, but nobody else has acted this way. You have been overreacting from the start, and if I was to vote, you're the one I would vote for right now. You'd better be scum...
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 12, 2009, 11:17:58
On Bored:
I dropped it because, after all, it is the first day, and we have no hard evidence, other than one past lie.
About the lie: I don't think any mafia would be dull enough to use the argument "I've never been the Mafia before", as it fails so easily.
If you had no solid evidence why did you vote in the first place?

It is obvious that NES has some kind of power role, but we don't know what kind yet. This is my first time playing, but I can understand if NES has a power role and wants to stay alive, that's fine, as long as it benefits the town.
You seem very convicted of your opinion of NES, I do not know what to make of this. What makes you think NES is definitely a power role? What if NES is just a regular townie and we're just blowing things out of proportion while the Mafia slip under our nose?

The rest of your post (reply #85) is your opinions of those who are inactive diluted in pro-town pep talking. You essentially have given nearly no reason for your sudden retraction other than "I made a mistake", which is fine in itself, but don't try (if you are) to inflate your posts with hot air.

Anyway, wanted to ask if the investigator would, if they found the mafia, reveal themselves to the public to let us know.
What would be your strategy having heard an investigator claim?

We'll see if everyone's still awake, first! Or, if anyone else is alive (has stuff been going on that I was left out on :shocked:? Everyone's dead... all my town friends...  :sad: that's why they stopped replying... uh-oh... I'm the mafia's next target!
Huh?

Are you suggesting that looking for solid evidence before voting is a bad thing? That's the way it comes out to me, and I just cannot follow that advice with a good conscience.
Who are you taking about? Who suggested that solid evidence searching is bad? :S
Also what advice? I don't see the connection with any previous post. You must be referring to Budja's post, but it doesn't make much sense.

On NES:
But alas, nobody trusts a wretch...
Huh? Explain.

I'm going to have to blindly vote T3c4n0g33k.
Why did you feel the need to vote Techno blindly? It's illogical. A townie doesn't feel the need to vote randomly.

As for voting, I might as well unvote if what the post at the time was proves true.
What post? Huh? You illogically voted and the illogically unvoted, it looks like.

I'm simply glad to see that logic has come through to the people, and for that, I am going to be grateful for.
What logic? You have provided us with nothing. What I said was that we should be cautious with lynching. If suspicion manifests itself in votes, then some of the votes on you were justified.

On NES:
I'll have to break my own rules by not using a quote to start a new argument on a suspect, but I would have to quote pages of angst ridden filler to talk about you.  X)

I consider it of poor sportsmanship to use situations and arguments independent of the game as tools in the game. Your behavior can either be explained and justified within the game, or must remain unexplained.
This is because all arguments which can't be checked inside the game (such as blaming strange behaviour with a real-life recent event) cannot be checked at all. Thus all such self-supporting arguments must be annulled.
NES, your behaviour remains unexplained in my eyes, and suspicion against it is entirely justified.

I make another point:
Let us assume you are a townie or at least a pro-town role.
Why in the world would you want to draw attention to your own death rather than honestly try to look for actual mafia? I would expect a townie in that position not to flip-out, as that is scummy, but rather battle the arguments against him with truth and, more importantly, question other players in attempt to expose Mafia.
If the townie has actually been acting suspicious (for any reason) then that townie is doomed. Why would a townie act suspicious? Only in rare tactical occasions (which usually occur in the last days) do townies purposefully attempt underhand schemes.

Let us assume you are scum.
Drawing attention to oneself also doesn't make sense, as it is not a classic mafia move at all. A mafia would not be so fragile as a mafia would expect common attacks against him.

This is where my argument get's stuck. I cannot imagine you being any town or mafia aligned role. Which brings me to my very sketchy conclusion, that NES being a serial killer is less likely than NES being a bit mad. Therefore I cannot say with even mediocre conviction what role NES is.

On Razzor:
[...]

Of course, he could still be mafia, and simply unvoted because he felt he was under pressure. That is just speculation though, and its nothing I want to base my vote on.
In fact, since neither his unvote has been properly justified nor his vote on NES in the first place, his eventual unvote makes him more suspicious, to me. A common Mafia tell is vote-switching to cater for the changing views of the town. However I'm not comfortable with a Bored vote or a FOS at the moment.

On Budja:
FoS: Lunar, Bored2Death for role-fishing, Lunar at least should know better.
Seriously how many times do you want to mention that NES probably has a PR.
Even if you suspect as much, you don't have to declare it to the whole town.

vote: Lunar for reasons above.
My alleged role-fishing was a theory. It has not been tested and can't be used as evidence on par with results from thorough questioning.
It was a rebuttal of the arguments against NES; a statement that an alternative explanation could be the case. I noticed that NES could be a power role, and saw that NES was most likely going to be lynched when the inactives came around (as they do once a month and vote he who has most votes :P). I felt that stating clearly my belief of NES' possible pro-towniness I could be saving a possible doctor or investigator from a very hasty lynch.

On the other hand, I took into consideration that NES might be completely scummy, and I decided that I would mount an examination of NES later on, when his life was not on the line, when I had time to make sure of my position on him. He may be a plain vanilla, although I stand by my position that it is most likely he is not.


You vote for me is strange. You attack me on role-fishing, when it is Bored who speaks with the most conviction and frequency on this subject. While your argument clearly supports that Bored is the more suspicious, you set me as your prime target. Why? You seem to contradict yourself by voting me and not Bored.


NES's use of language seems still slightly forced. I have never seen NES speak in such prose before.
Indeed. He likes his Middle English but NES is behaving out of character.

Also, I'd be most comfortable with an inactive lynch. Think about it. The mafia and the SK will favour killing peeps who talk, so they can dominate. Imagine having an endgame where conversation is basically led by a mafia. Or worse, where conversation isn't led, because it doesn't exist.

Forgive any mistakes, wall of text :3
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 12, 2009, 12:16:23
Alright, that makes sense. I can't deny the fact that this board is fond of quick-lynches. I am not fully happy with it, but I can understand it.

I voted for you over Bored solely on meta-based reasons. I was surprised you would do such a move because I know you too be a good player.

Quote from: Lunar
Also, I'd be most comfortable with an inactive lynch. Think about it. The mafia and the SK will favour killing peeps who talk, so they can dominate. Imagine having an endgame where conversation is basically led by a mafia. Or worse, where conversation isn't led, because it doesn't exist.

I don't like inactive lynches but you are right. I don't want a NES lynch (at least until I can actually understand him)
and I don't really fancy any alternatives at this time. At the least, this will encourage activity. vote: Igiari as I have yet so see a mafia game where he posts more than once or so. (Hows that for a 180 view-change :P)

@Town, if you have "nothing to post", you are not looking. You could agree/disagree with someone, state your position on an issue (e.g. NES, lurker lynch, whatever), you don't have to post that much, just at least let us know you are actually alive.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Kasran on June 12, 2009, 15:39:33
Hrm.
This is one of the reasons why I don't usually join this game: I'm always outclassed as far as arguments go. :P

(The other reason is because I have been lynch-meat in the past.)
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 12, 2009, 21:05:11
@ Lunar's guess of me being a vanilla and the town is blowing it outta proportion.
I can assure you Lunar, that you are not a lunatic for thinking that.  In all due honesty, the reasons of my objectionable logic was just about dissected, but to fit the final part of the puzzle of the logic of yours, if I read well, is whether I was venting, or a genuine serial killer.  I've to say that I am gravely sorry for my mood swings lately, as well, junk happens to the best.  So Lunar, I might as well give confessions to all the quotes that belonged to me.
Quote 1:  That little statement was my underconfidence that savagery would win over civilization, and that once I was condemned, I'd see that dreadful stake of wood.
Quote 2:  Being honest, I wanted to keep this secret, but I've to confess.  I actually thought of getting information from techno...  Much like how everyone thinks to reveal the truth.  I see I've failed rather miserably, and only brought me to the verge of being the tree's first ornament.
Quote 3:  I was referencing Bored2death's theory of techno potentially being a POWER role.
Quote 4:  Alas, this was indeed a moment of me spewing garbage.  I just was in slight relief there.
History incident:  Another idiotic moment I pulled, several times in hopes of dissuading people to hang me and try to repeat the history of a mafia win.  Overall, I used history rather foolishly and am doomed to repeat my potential death.
Unusual moves:  What in heck was I supposed to do!?  Get hung only to blurt out something potentially fatal to the town?  I merely had to try and save my rear, so the town wouldn't detriment.  Translation:  I was trying to defend myself, and nearly failed at that.
Final part of theory:  I've to say the theory's fairly developed, but the conclusion unfortunately is faulty for one vital fact.  [vital fact]What if there is no serial killer?[/vital fact]
If there are any more questions, please do not hesitate to ask...
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Shawnachu on June 12, 2009, 23:07:34
Quote from: Purple Pineapple
Serial Killer

Every night you can kill one person by PMing me their name.  You win when you equal or outnumber the town. If it's you and a mafia member, you win. If it's you and a mafia roleblocker, the mafia wins.

...there is a Serial Killer.  :huh: What are you talking about?

Also, the fact that you randomly voted T3c4n0g33k and not Lunar_Tick (who actually has a vote) makes it look like you don't care who lives or dies.

(About my statement that there's no way to get an accurate lynch on the first day, I completely agree that more conversation leads to more info for the town. You still can't get solid evidence, though. :/ However, pushing people into a corner makes them more likely to make mistakes)
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 13, 2009, 00:39:25
First, by the way, he isn't using leet speak anymore... it's technogeek now. Anyway, chances are there is a serial killer, and we didn't imply NES could only be a serial killer, so why defend yourself from being sk? You don't seem to defend yourself from being mafia there...
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Razzorman on June 13, 2009, 14:42:29
Also, the fact that you randomly voted T3c4n0g33k and not Lunar_Tick (who actually has a vote) makes it look like you don't care who lives or dies.
He randomly voted for technogeek in the beginning of the day, at which point it is sort of OK to do that. This was way before Lunar said anything at all.

Anyway, chances are there is a serial killer, and we didn't imply NES could only be a serial killer, so why defend yourself from being sk? You don't seem to defend yourself from being mafia there...
He could simply have misunderstood Lunar when he said:
Quote
I cannot imagine you being any town or mafia aligned role. Which brings me to my very sketchy conclusion, that NES being a serial killer is less likely than NES being a bit mad.
NES probably just skimmed through the post to get the greater picture instead of reading it more carefully. This seems a little weird to me. Why are you rushing your defense NES?

Also, Bored, why do you get so worked up every time NES says something? You seem to be very focused on him right now.
Just theoretically; if you where forced to vote, and can't vote for NES, who would it be?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 13, 2009, 17:26:18
If that was the case, it would be Budja... theoretically, of course. The reason would be that Budja seems to keep trying to lead everybody to just vote for one person or the other, possibly because he doesn't care who's lynched, as long as somebody's lynched? At this point in the game, one can't have enough hard evidence to make a really good vote... however, if we could get the game progressing, we'll have more evidence...
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 13, 2009, 17:59:01
My reason for rushing defense:  The time to present defense gradually shrunk and at an alarming rate.  It was either rush my defense and potentially botch my defense, or go at it slowly and risk being a tree ornament.  Knowing typical mafia works, the town usually starts with a savagely fast lynch for day one, so out of savage (or I should say paranoid) reaction, I had to quickly prepare a defense statement, so in this case, it wasn't due to I wanted to (and believe me, I do not want to botch my defense), but I had to go swiftly or get killed in a grueling manner that wouldn't be right.

(Translation:  I basically was put on rush job with the votes compiling quickly, and as I have mentioned before, was thrown into a state of literal panic, so I had to act fast to save my skin.)
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: TechnoGeek on June 13, 2009, 18:01:53
i think a time limit should be set at this point. this has been going on for a while, and we seem to be getting nowhere.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Bored2death on June 13, 2009, 18:10:54
I am in total agreement.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Dataflashsabot on June 13, 2009, 18:37:08
I agree also.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 13, 2009, 19:25:57
Another of the strange anomalies of this forum's Mafia games!
A deadline = putting less pressure on mafia = a hastier, more random lynch = less likely we get anywhere near mafia.
It also means that we completely ignore the fact that 50% of the players are participating nearly not at all in the game.
The reason nothing is getting done is simple: inactivity of this great percentile. You guys, you're just helping the other side.

I would do a whole coverage of the issue, but I couldn't be bothered. I am violently opposed to imposing a deadline, need be I'll propose alternatives. I implore the mod to understand that such actions would only spawn further decline in the standard of Mafia.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 13, 2009, 19:33:46
I think it is hypocritical for one to say that we are getting nowhere when one has furthered the search for mafia either very slightly or not at all.

I have no idea what Techno thinks about the current situations of the game, let alone Data, Igiari, Firecat or any other of the players (bar Budja, NES and Bored).

How can the town possibly formulate a accurate opinion on all these players if they do not openly express themselves? It is impossible! The town is doomed to selfdestruction when the majority deny to comment!
I don't ask you to comment meticulously on every word every player says (as I do), that is excessive (apparently). But I'd like to know who you thought was scum. I'd like to know if you think NES is a huge arse or just misunderstood or if Bored changes are erratic or if I'm doing some kind of reverse psychology and pulling you all along. I'd just like to know anything. Write a paragraph. That's the point of the game.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: LimeLemon on June 13, 2009, 21:14:36
Oh please god... come on now people!
Discuss! FOS! Vote! DO SOMETHING!
It feels like this day will never end...

I've already voted and said what I have to say, I'm just waiting for the lynch.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Razzorman on June 13, 2009, 21:52:26
Alright, time to get verbose. I am going to write down my honest opinion on everyone in the game, in the order they are listed in the first post.

- koromi
Early in the game, you overreacted slightly to a random vote on yourself. This was pointed out, and you instantly wanted everyone to stop voting.
This may have been because you wanted a sensible lynch, like you said, or it could have been because you wanted people to look the other way and start thinking about other players instead.
You haven't said anything since page 4 either, which means that you stopped talking as soon as you got rid of our attention.
Likelihood of being mafia: 4/5

- Bored2death
You confuse me. First you started pushing for a lynch on NES because you thought he was doing the same for random votes, then you immediately stopped when everyone started to unvote.
I cant tell if you stopped because you was unsure of your vote on NES, or simply to go with the crowd though.
Another reason for unvoting, is that you are mafia, and your partner is lunar, whom you don't want to disagree with.
That is pretty far fetched though.
Since then, you have been focused on NES, either because you want the bandwagon going again or because you are suspicious of him. There is nothing I can say for sure though, so I'm going to say; Likelihood of being mafia: 3/5

- Budja
You have been keeping a low profile by posting overall agreeable arguments against higher profile people, and by being somewhat inactive.
I don't know what to think actually. If you are mafia, you are very good at it.
I'm going to give you a low likelihood for being mafia, but that doesn't mean much.
You could still be the serial killer, since it would be very much in your interest to find and kill at least one mafia member.
I'm going to wait and see with you though.
Likelihood for being mafia 1/5. Likelihood for being serial killer 3/5

- LimeLemon
Your first post was encouraging random votes, but I guess it shouldn't be taken too seriously. (note the -.-)
You later voted for yourself without explaining why, and then jumped on the NESwagon along with everybody else, without really explaining why.
Budja pointed this out, and you simply stated:
Quote
I had nothing to say that not already had been said.
You haven't said anything real since then. Why?
Likelihood of being mafia: 2/5

- Lunar_Tick
I can't quite place you anywhere either.
You have been trying to get the town to play an overall better game of mafia, which is OK. Nothing really suspicious about that.
On the other hand, you have been throwing out half done investigations on a lot of people in your posts.
It seems like you are trying to draw attention away from yourself by continuously pointing the other direction.
Likelihood for being mafia: 1/5

- Dataflashsabot
You begin by randomly voting for NES, you disappear, and then reappear saying something I interpret as "I agree with someone but I don't want to say who."
Likelihood for being mafia, 2/5

- shawnachu
First you say something along the lines of "There really is no intellectual way to vote on the first day."
This was opposed not once, but twice, and you gave up trying to defend your statement in the same post you jumped on the NESwagon with the reason very bad reason "he is defending himself".
This could have been for two reasons.
1: you were convinced that you was wrong, and though NES was likely to be mafia.
2: you realized that you couldn't get people to finish of the first day with a random vote, and saw a bandwagon you could use instead.
The latter is a little bit more likely to me, so I'm going to give you a likelihood for being mafia at 3/5

- Igiari
You haven't said anything, either because you are mafia and don't want anyones attention, or because you forgot you are playing. I know you are here enough to have said at least something by now. (as a matter of fact, you were online today)
Likelihood for being mafia 3/5

- Kasran
The absolute first thing you did was to jump the NESwagon, only to unvote immediately when lunar put forth some reasons to not vote for him.
After that, you descended into inactivity, which you explained by saying that you are bad at arguing and usually get lynched, none of which are very good reasons for staying out of the game.
Likelihood for being mafia: 2/5

- Razzorman
You are an arrogant and ignorant hypocritical moron. Everything you have said so far has been one huge contradictory mess. What is wrong with you?
Seriously. How can you not vote for this guy...? He is so obviously mafia. And the serial killer.
Likelihood for being mafia: 5/5. JK :P

- Firecat
In you only post you refer to the last game of mafia, saying that we need to be careful and not lynch any good roles.
This is not very suspicious in itself, but considering that it's the only thing you have said in the entire game, you could just as well be trying to confuse us all.
Likelihood for being mafia: 2/5

- NESgamer190
You are overly paranoid about everything. So much so that I cant help but think you have some kind of important role.
Until just recently, you provided no evidence as to what that role may be, but here (http://nifflas.ni2.se/forum/index.php?topic=990.msg10885#msg10885) you missunderstand lunar, thinking he accused you for being a serial killer, which he really didn't. Could it be that you expected him to come to that conclusion?
I don't think you are very likely to be mafia, but you are all the more likely to be the serial killer.
Likelihood for being mafia 2/5. Likelihood for being serial killer 4/5

- TechnoGeek
You have been semi-inactive throughout the game. You start by Jumping on the NESwagon. Unlike many others though, you kept your vote for NES even after most people had unvoted.
You asked for a time limit just now so we would get the day done. If the time limit is announced, a lot of us are going to vote on the one we feel are the most likely to be mafia. As it is now, it is NES who is going to die if we get a time limit.
So, the reasons for why you suddenly want everyone to throw their votes is either that you want NES to die because he isn't mafia, or that you simply want everyone to get back to the game.
Likelihood for being mafia: 2/5

Based on my what I have said, I am going to vote: koromi.

Come on people! Voice your opinions! What do you think about this?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Dataflashsabot on June 13, 2009, 22:20:16
I randomly voted NES, but judging by his overreaction and his further overreaction to the reactions to his overreaction, I now firmly believe he has something to hide. Mafia, SK, I'm not sure, but I doubt a humble Townsperson would behave like this...

I can't figure out why he's been so vocal though- if he was Mafia/SK he would probably try to keep a low profile... unless he's double bluffing?

koromi... personally I think he's okay, he may have just not had anything to say on the matter that other people haven't said. As you point out, I was like that too, so I can understand.

Based on the above, I'm sticking with NESgamer190.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: koromi on June 14, 2009, 01:13:32
three things:

You haven't said anything since page 4 either, which means that you stopped talking as soon as you got rid of our attention.

it seems to me that you think i am mafia because i haven't posted since page 4.
i can't be expected to post every page, and it isn't fair to vote for somebody simply because they are inactive.

Early in the game, you overreacted slightly to a random vote on yourself. This was pointed out, and you instantly wanted everyone to stop voting.

i just don't want to be out of a mafia game by the first night. (as is evidenced in previous games)
are you supposed to shrug of a vote, knowing that when you are lynched as a martyr the whole town can see they have lynched one of their own?

though i don't think at this point in the game you can be outed as pushing for a quick lynch, but you should still not pick on someone you thought wasn't going to speak for the rest of the day and therefore wouldn't have anything to defend himself. perhaps razzorman is just pushing for the lynching of me so he can get to the nightkilling?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 14, 2009, 02:24:44
I second Lunar, a deadline is unnecessary. If you want a quicker day then speak up, if you simply wait it will only take longer.

Quote from: Limelemon
I've already voted and said what I have to say, I'm just waiting for the lynch.
All you have done is agree with the case on NES and place your vote. Hardly much contribution.

Anyone who is saying, "I have nothing to say which has not already been said", is wrong. Your view, even if it is just an agreement/disagreement is important. We need to know you position on these arguement even if you have nothing further to say.

I want everyone to tell me whether they would prefer a NES lynch, an inactive lynch or neither.

Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 14, 2009, 02:38:36
After reading up on Razzor's information, I simply have reached a conclusion at last.
Credit for Razzorman for the opinion.  (Yes, I've read them all.)
Quote
- koromi
Early in the game, you overreacted slightly to a random vote on yourself. This was pointed out, and you instantly wanted everyone to stop voting.
This may have been because you wanted a sensible lynch, like you said, or it could have been because you wanted people to look the other way and start thinking about other players instead.
You haven't said anything since page 4 either, which means that you stopped talking as soon as you got rid of our attention.
Likelihood of being mafia: 4/5
A point well pointed out that I also fell upon by bad mistake.
It is plausible he, not unlike myself, desire a sensible lynch, but then again, a scapegoat is usually utilized day one.
Hmm...  with the lack of activity, the person is likely staying out of dodge of the voting obsessed, something usually seen in general, but to this extent concerns me to think this is a potential candidate of mafia.
Voting verdict:  Koromi, as much as I would like to see you last beyond day one, I've simply to vote Koromi.

The following quote is from the reasoning of Dataflashsabot.
Quote
I can't figure out why he's been so vocal though- if he was Mafia/SK he would probably try to keep a low profile... unless he's double bluffing?
A double bluff?  Could you please explain the double bluff, as far as I see, if I were to double bluff, then I'd be bluffing on my bluff of being a power role, and theoretically, am a townie.  A little input would be nice for this form of reverse psychology...
@Budja's Lynch choices:  So far, I'm undecided, but if I am required to give thee an answer now, then let it be an inactive that is hung.  A no lynch on day one almost always is a bad omen in mafia in general, and requesting myself to die would be foolhardy unless I am a jester, which as far as I know is not in this game of mafia, (Anyone unsure of jester, here it is:  The jester wins via getting lynched, but loses if he lives or dies any other way.) which leaves me to a conclusion of inactive lynch.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 14, 2009, 11:03:22
On the other hand, you have been throwing out half done investigations on a lot of people in your posts.
What do you mean by half done? Comparatively, I think my investigations are at least pretty regular.

I'm more happy with an Igiari lynch rather than a Koromi lynch.
Although Koromi is somewhat scummy (which at this point is high), what if he's town? We'd be losing a half-decent semi-regular player.
Whereas lynching Igiari things are different. Although there is a much slimmer chance of lynching a Mafia, we are completely sure that we don't kill a townie.

I'm between Koromi and Igiari at this point. When I get up I'll fling some poo around.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Razzorman on June 14, 2009, 11:43:28
On the other hand, you have been throwing out half done investigations on a lot of people in your posts.
What do you mean by half done? Comparatively, I think my investigations are at least pretty regular.
I mean that they are just short quotes with captions telling us what you think. You don't always bring up evidence against those you are investigating, you just make them look a little bit suspicious and let it go like that.
Its still very helpful though.

Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: LimeLemon on June 15, 2009, 00:31:26
Whereas lynching Igiari things are different. Although there is a much slimmer chance of lynching a Mafia, we are completely sure that we don't kill a townie.

...What!? Did you just claim to know 100% for sure that Igiari is anti-tonwie?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: TechnoGeek on June 15, 2009, 01:16:24
Whereas lynching Igiari things are different. Although there is a much slimmer chance of lynching a Mafia, we are completely sure that we don't kill a townie.

...What!? Did you just claim to know 100% for sure that Igiari is anti-tonwie?
yes, how do you know for sure he's not a townsperson?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 15, 2009, 22:21:30
Oops.

Insert "useful" between "a" and "townie".
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Kasran on June 16, 2009, 00:10:16
Well, I have to agree with Razzorman's assessment of me. Honestly, I suck at this game; and I acknowledge that I made several bad decisions early on.

Really, the only thing I can do is vote based on someone else's assessment, which is jumping on bandwagons and therefore bad. So I'll keep my unvote for the moment.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 16, 2009, 21:36:37
@all, vote Igiari or explain why not.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: koromi on June 16, 2009, 21:56:08
explain why not.

everyone should have the opportunity to defend themselves. that being said, an inactive player is annoying and just a waste of a space where someone else could be actively mafia-ing. 
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Igiari on June 19, 2009, 00:02:29
Excuse me, I forgot about the mafia game, and when I was going to begin with it again I went on a vacation that I've been spending the latest week on.

With that said I want to say that I won't continue participate in this game of mafia. You can decide to lynch me, make commit suicide or whatever you want. I've missed too much of this days discussion to participate in it.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 19, 2009, 03:10:49
@Igiari, not that much has really happened.

@mod, I suggest you attempt to find a replacement for Igiari if you can.

unvote
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: LimeLemon on June 20, 2009, 01:00:59
Can everyone vote please?
There must be SOMEONE you suspect! So what are you waiting for?
And to all you people who will blame me for being mafia and wanting a quick lynch, I just want this day to end. Of course it's not good to vote randomly, but it has been a so long time so... yea. There should be enough "evidence" for a vote. At least say something! People are supposed to be active in this game.
If you haven't voted, do it, or give me a REALLY good reason why not to.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 24, 2009, 16:01:37
Meep.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: TechnoGeek on June 25, 2009, 17:28:21
Meep.
huh?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Razzorman on June 25, 2009, 23:17:01
Sigh. I'm quitting the game. Nobody is playing anyways, so I doubt it really matters that much.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: LimeLemon on June 26, 2009, 01:03:03
Seriously, the game have been super inactive since we implemented that FOS thing and blamed everyone that voted for being mafia.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 26, 2009, 05:19:11
Oh yes. Shame on us for actually scumhunting and not just randomly voting :P.

If people want to play, I will continue playing but people actually have to be interested in playing.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Purple Pineapple on June 26, 2009, 06:06:54
I'm shutting this game down if less than three people have posted by same time tomorrow. The problem here seems to be that no one's actually gotten lynched.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 26, 2009, 08:57:12
Duly noted.
In future (not that this game is over, but still) a conscientious but realistic mod will not accept the earliest of entrants to his or her game, but those that have not displayed an extremely negative record.
I'm still playing.
Budja for being all against me.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: koromi on June 26, 2009, 09:10:45
vote:budja for the purpose of continuing the game. (though perhaps that is a bit hypocritical..)
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 26, 2009, 13:20:02
vote Igiari.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Firecat on June 26, 2009, 20:58:01
Im voting Igiari, trough i dont want so, this day its taking way too much, and he seems to dont want to play.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Shawnachu on June 26, 2009, 22:03:35
I'll unvote: NES and vote: Igiari. This game is taking WAY too long.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 26, 2009, 22:33:07
Ok then Igiari.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: LimeLemon on June 27, 2009, 17:02:11
With that said I want to say that I won't continue participate in this game of mafia.

If no one noticed.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Budja on June 27, 2009, 18:03:42
I noticed, but it is a chance to trim off our dead-weight and this may also revive the game.

If you have a better idea, speak up.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: LimeLemon on June 27, 2009, 18:41:32
Okay sure, but doesn't that count as resigning?
I vote Igiari.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Purple Pineapple on June 27, 2009, 19:14:29
Back when Igiari posted that, I PMed Salmoneous if he wanted to take his place. I haven't heard back yet, so if Igiari isn't lynched, he's going to die in his sleep. *shrug*
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: LimeLemon on June 27, 2009, 19:21:38
Then let's get over with it. Everyone vote Igiari! Could you PM all players?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: NESgamer190 on June 27, 2009, 20:30:10
Apologies for slight inactivity, but it seems we've a voting upon Igiari.
Unvoting to vote Igiari due to Limelemon saying it.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Dataflashsabot on June 27, 2009, 21:18:16
Unvote NESgamer190, vote Igiari.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: LimeLemon on June 27, 2009, 21:23:48
That's 7 votes.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: TechnoGeek on June 27, 2009, 23:34:06
That's 7 votes.
then this is unnecessary, but vote:Igiari
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Night 1
Post by: Purple Pineapple on June 28, 2009, 00:17:24
And so, the long day finally drew to a close. As soon as Budja noticed Igiari, sleeping in a corner, it was decided. In the end, with an 8th vote to back it up, Igiari was lynched. The sun had set. Everyone returned to his or her house, leaving a dead townie lying in a corner of the meeting hall.

Igiari, townsperson, lynched day 1.

All night roles have until June 28, 24:00:00 (one day) to PM me their actions. The night ends officially the 29th 24:00:00
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Purple Pineapple on June 30, 2009, 01:00:19
The town rose the next morning to find Bored2death's throat slit.

Bored2death, townsperson, throat slit night 1

Alive:
- koromi
- Budja
- LimeLemon
- Lunar_Tick
- Dataflashsabot
- shawnachu
- Kasran
- Razzorman
- Firecat
- NESgamer190
- T3c4n0g33k
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: LimeLemon on June 30, 2009, 15:24:52
Only one kill? Does that mean there is no serial killer?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 30, 2009, 16:23:00
Or that the SK didn't kill or that the mafia didn't kill or that some kill was blocked, or that there isn't a SK yes.


 
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Budja on June 30, 2009, 16:40:45
...or possibly that the SK was inactive. So many options that it isn't really worthwhile speculating over.

The bored kill surprises me as he was not looking very protown to me.



Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: TechnoGeek on June 30, 2009, 17:32:36
Alright, now that day and night 1 are over, I would like to say that, again, two townspeople have died, and we're about as far as possible from knowing who mafia is.  To me the most suspicious here so far is Budja, who seems to be targeting a few people. so, just to start the day off, FoS:Budja
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: LimeLemon on June 30, 2009, 17:38:26
Alright, now that day and night 1 are over, I would like to say that, again, two townspeople have died, and we're about as far as possible from knowing who mafia is.

No, ONE townie died.
I don't think that's a typo... I mean, seriously, that's a big typo. Because he couldn't possibly have meant one townspeople since people suggests there are more than one person. And one townsperson is too far away.
It looks like he didn't read the first post, and assume two have died. What if he is mafia, and intended to kill someone, but the doctor chose to protect that person?

FOS: TechnoGeek until you have defended yourself.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Budja on June 30, 2009, 17:53:49
Quote from: Techno
Alright, now that day and night 1 are over, I would like to say that, again, two townspeople have died

Read more carefully, it looks like he is also refering to Igiari.

@Techno, care to elaborate? Suspecting, questioning multiple people is not scummy btw.

Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Shawnachu on June 30, 2009, 18:07:58
Well, now that we have a death, we can assume that whoever was most opposing Bored probably also wanted him dead...  :/

In this way, I point my FOS(s) at NES and Lunar, but am ready to change my vote if someone brings up a good point.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on June 30, 2009, 19:35:30
Well at least he was talking. :3
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: LimeLemon on June 30, 2009, 22:56:13
Quote from: Techno
Alright, now that day and night 1 are over, I would like to say that, again, two townspeople have died

Read more carefully, it looks like he is also refering to Igiari.

*facepalm*
Oops. Oh well, at least I got a discussion started... I think.

But anyway, I'm still suspicious of NES. FOS: NESGamer190
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: TechnoGeek on June 30, 2009, 23:46:45
yes, I did mean the day and the night.

I think we are heading toward the NESwagon again, and I will refrain from doing so this time.  However, Lunar_Tick also seems rather suspicious, because, as LimeLemon has pointed out, he seemed very opposed to Bored2Death.  And LimeLemon seems suspicious too, because he was surprised there was only 1 kill, making me think he could be mafia as well.

And i'm the most suspicious of all, I can't even spell suspicious without red underlines :sigh:
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: LimeLemon on July 01, 2009, 00:37:14
The reason I commented on the only 1 kill thing was because I wanted to start a discussion. I wasn't really surprised.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: NESgamer190 on July 01, 2009, 00:43:13
So far, I've developed a small consensus, which likely leaves us with two outcomes:
1:  Bored2death died and the most objectionable to his beliefs is mafia.  (Not quite plausible)
2:  Limelemon's just poked at the wrong place at the wrong time.
Either way, I'm going to have to go on the former of the two, and fos limelemon, seeing he did oppose bored2death, and bored was townie.  (Not to go against my theory, but I am completely aware of the town making a fluke now and then, and I am not doing this fos in retaliation to limelemon's fos.)
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 01, 2009, 09:57:29
I don't see the logic behind assuming that Bored's opposition necessarily is the town's opposition. Holders of this opinion, form an argument.

On Shawn:

Why is opposing somebodies argument, showing the fallacies that they (perhaps unwittingly) used in an argument mean that you want them dead? (!)

Also, you seem to overlook
I vote: Bored2death.

Which also doesn't mean anything at all. Have you ulterior motives Shawn?








Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: LimeLemon on July 01, 2009, 13:21:53
Either way, I'm going to have to go on the former of the two, and fos limelemon, seeing he did oppose bored2death, and bored was townie.  (Not to go against my theory, but I am completely aware of the town making a fluke now and then, and I am not doing this fos in retaliation to limelemon's fos.)

What are you talking about? I can't remember opposing bored!
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: NESgamer190 on July 01, 2009, 15:12:00
Forgive me limelemon...  My mind has been on frappe when I said that.  (In other words, I had a bit of a tough time remembering and thought about shawnachu's theory.)
Now that Lunar pokes a new thing out, I've actually begun to think shawnachu's beginning to flake off here.  Until we get a concrete reason, I will simply have to have a FOS upon shawnachu.  There very well is the theory that those who voted for bored, may have been townies themselves, and as such, proves a fluke in a seemingly plausible theory.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 1
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 02, 2009, 15:21:42
@all, vote Igiari or explain why not.
Interesting post. Why was a vote for Igiari taken for granted anyway?

Yeah. So it's been, what, five days since day 2 started?

FOS: koromi
FOS: Dataflashsabot
FOS: Kasran
FOS: Razzorman
FOS: Firecat


Which are, I believe, those who haven't yet posted. Lets face it, a lurker is probably worse than a wolf.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Dataflashsabot on July 02, 2009, 17:29:33
FOS:Limelemon He accused technogeek unnecessarily (he said just to start a discussion, but it seems to me that there are milder ways to do that) and appears to be jumping on the NESwagon because it's the easiest option.  (Just my opinion, but of the options Limelemon seems the most suspicious right now.)
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Razzorman on July 02, 2009, 18:04:32
There are only two reasons I can think of for why bored was killed during the night.
1. Killing bored was intended to start the NESwagon again.
2. NES is mafia.

Also, lynching igiari seemd kinda pointless to me. He wasn't playing anyways, so he couldn't possibly have been a threat. FOS: Budja
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 02, 2009, 23:45:22
There are only two reasons I can think of for why bored was killed during the night.
As a general comment, I think it should be said that perhaps we are reading too much importance into the night kills. The mafia saw a talkative townie and they did silence him. Any drama we distill from this is little more than speculation, is it not?

1. Killing bored was intended to start the NESwagon again.
2. NES is mafia.
Hm. The mafia probably killed Bored to stir up drama.
If this isn't the case then, yeah. I disagree with point 2. You're saying that NES is probably evil so he silenced Bored? After I defeated Bored's main arguments against NES I doubt Bored would bring them back D2 and he wouldn't be a threat to NES really. And NES was pretty much free from heat from most of the town. So I don't see why NES would kill Bored. NES could be mafia because he behaved completely stupidly day one, drawing attention to himself and getting all drama-ous, but that's a different issue.
But strategically, killing Bored doesn't really make sense for a NES-mafioso.

He wasn't playing anyways, so he couldn't possibly have been a threat.
Fallacy. People lurking are of the highest threat to the town, perhaps regardless of their win condition.

FOS: Budja
Woah where did this come from?

FOS:Limelemon [...]
Pretty justified stuff right there.
Although we will look like right twats if we lynch Limelemon for a slip and he turns out to be a Townie (!). Although that is unlikely at the moment. There are others to check out.

Koromi cos he kinda flipped day 1. Has been pretty silent Day 1 and 2 and has brought as about as much to the table as a lost hippopotamus who is allergic to tables. And talking.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: LimeLemon on July 03, 2009, 00:56:25
Was that a vote?
I have always been suspicious of lurkers, but it's really stupid to vote them just like that.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Budja on July 03, 2009, 01:13:35
@Razzor and those with simular opinions, Sorry, I start a wagon on Igiari and I get the suspicion. Look at all the people who followed me, I was hardly alone :huh:.
We removed a dead weight which is a bit better than a ranodm lynch anyway.

Lunar is right, focusing too much on Bored's death is unhealthy for the town. the mafia don't choose there targets to help us, you know.
TBH, I am not too bothered by the death anyway as I was finding Bored a little scummy anyway.

Another thing, Townie's can disagree with townies. In general, a disagreement between two people is no way implies one has to be scum.

I don't find Limelemon's 'slip' particulary suspicious.

@Limelemon, why is it stupid to vote lurkers?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: LimeLemon on July 03, 2009, 03:26:53
Since they haven't said anything, it's a random vote. Random votes are bad.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Razzorman on July 03, 2009, 08:58:28
Fallacy. People lurking are of the highest threat to the town, perhaps regardless of their win condition.
True, but igiari wasn't lurking. He announced that he had not, and wasn't going to participate in this game of mafia. Purple pineapple even tried to replace him with Salmoneous, so I think its safe to say the he wasn't playing, and therefor not much of a threat to the town.

FOS: Budja
Woah where did this come from?
From here:
@all, vote Igiari or explain why not.
This was ok before igiari announced that he wasn't playing, but he didn't vote for igiari until a while after igiari quit.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 03, 2009, 10:02:08
I don't see what Razzor's argument is about the Igiari lynch.
He wasn't a threat yeah, but what if he was a wolf? Wouldn't we be very stupid if we dismissed him as too silent to be any threat?

I don't see the error in lynching lurkers as a matter of course. In fact, it is a viable strategy. Not only does it shrink the pool of potential wolf suspects, but also shrinks the pool of lurkers and quiet people, which helps twofold in helping the hunt against wolves.

Let me:

Lynching a talkative person:
   If he's town: We've lost a good supportive and active townie. He have helped the mafias in a big way.
   If he's mafia: Hooray! It doesn't really matter if he's talkative or not.

Lynching a silent person:
   If he's town: We haven't really lost a proper townie, so we aren't hindering the hunt of mafias, so we aren't helping the mafias.
   If he's mafia: Hooray! It doesn't really matter if he's talkative or not.

So knowing nothing, one would always go with lynching a silent person. It's the better choice obviously (at least in a perfect world). It is true that this is never the case, we always know something and can learn a lot more through the aforementioned channels of action, but seriously who could predict with more than 50% (say) accuracy (which is pretty crap in itself) on the first day who is mafia?

Concluding, I must say that if this day draws on and we find ourselves knowing nothing, or little, (either because of the towns bad playing or because of the mafias good playing) I will support a lynch of the most inactive player.

This does not mean I will not search actively for our enemies, nor does it mean I have resigned to a pre-set system of playing.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 03, 2009, 10:02:56
(That post was countering Limelemon (as well (?)))
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Razzorman on July 03, 2009, 10:44:07
I completely agree. Lynching inactive players is a good thing to do if you have no evidence against anybody.
However, lynching someone like igiari who isn't even playing just makes no sense to me.
I guess what I'm trying to say is; It didn't matter if he was mafia or not. Even if he was, he wouldn't have been assisting the other mafia member.
(That post was countering Limelemon (as well (?)))
Not to the same extent, but yeah, I'm a bit suspicious of him too.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 03, 2009, 14:05:43
I guess what I'm trying to say is; It didn't matter if he was mafia or not. Even if he was, he wouldn't have been assisting the other mafia member.
A mafia doesn't have to post in the thread to be useful. In fact, a mafia member benefits, as does the whole mafia, from not posting in the thread and encouraging (directly or indirectly) the townies to do the same. If we condone such behaviour, well, we lose.

You should also take this mod post into account:
Back when Igiari posted that, I PMed Salmoneous if he wanted to take his place. I haven't heard back yet, so if Igiari isn't lynched, he's going to die in his sleep. *shrug*
Which means some things, but I wont over analyze at the moment.

This too, about Koromi, I forgot to add:
vote:budja for the purpose of continuing the game. (though perhaps that is a bit hypocritical..)
Totally jumped on a bandwagon when the game was dying, seems like a last chance attempt to get a townie killed. With the interesting behaviour Koromi displayed D1 I totally support a Koromi lynch at the moment. He's inactive and theres a good chance he's mafia, so I see it as a win-win(lose) situation for the town. :3
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 03, 2009, 14:09:22
I'm a bit suspicious of him too.
I am not suspicious of him.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Kasran on July 03, 2009, 14:35:20
Well, I'm kind of stuck. Having no analysis skills, I am forced to make my decisions based on someone else's arguments.
Not voting makes me suspect because then I'm inactive.
Voting based on somebody else's arguments makes me suspect because then I'm jumping on bandwagons.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaa.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Budja on July 03, 2009, 14:51:07
Try to ask questions on behaviour or actions you don't understand or think are suspicious.

Expand on your thoughts if you can.

---

@Lunar, why is Koromi's bandwagoning more suspicious than the whole Igiari bandwagon?
@Limelemon, voting for lurkers is not random voting because it is based on something that could be scummy (lurking).


Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: LimeLemon on July 03, 2009, 15:09:36
I don't like your "logic", Lunar.
We should encourage the lurkers to become more active instead of just killing them.
FOS: Lunar
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 03, 2009, 15:34:19
@Lunar, why is Koromi's bandwagoning more suspicious than the whole Igiari bandwagon?

Koromi didn't really start a bandwagon since except from the first two votes nobody voted for you, but I digress, this is unimportant. I theorised that he may have wanted to start a bangwagon against Budja so an easy lynch of said Budja would be, and thus Koromi is likely to be scum.

What I found suspicious was the fact that it seemed that he felt that someone had to be killed, but he gave no reason to vote for you.
My vote was more of a randomish prod vote. Everybody was inactive, I thought I might jump start the game (a reason I voted for you is that I expected an answer or reaction from you).
Whereas a second vote on you meant increased and serious support for the killing of Budja in a much larger way, in my opinion, compared to my first vote.
And since there wasn't reason for that second vote on Budja by Koromi, it seems that Koromi was grasping for a lynch by starting a bandwagon. Koromi could counter this but he'd have to come up with something good soon.

The difference between a (albeit theoretical future) bandwagon against Budja and a bandwagon against Igiari, is that, in my opinion, the Igiari bandwagon, and later the Igiari lynch was justified and a reasonably good move for the town. By lynching you so short-sightedly would be hasty, at that point at least, to say the least.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 03, 2009, 15:49:50
I don't like your "logic", Lunar.
We should encourage the lurkers to become more active instead of just killing them.
FOS: Lunar

I don't see what you are disputing exactly. I think my argument was clear, and logically sound. If you disagree with it, then provide me with an alternative logical argument on the past and present events.

That being said, voting for and killing a player is very different.

That being said, perhaps my pessimism, or rather my realism on the subject of attempting to higher the standard of Mafia on this forum is clouding my view of a better solution to the problem. If you have one, fire away.

Yes my so-called so-called logic on that matter is based on the assumption that lurkers probably don't get active quick, if at all. But I think that it's a fairly accurate assumption that only fails if one takes into account weird cases of absence and sudden returnal or immense change in character of a player.



wanted to start a bangwagon against Budja
bangwagon
XD
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Budja on July 03, 2009, 15:50:07
@LL, threatening lurkers with a lynch is sometimes necessary to lure them out. If they start contribution the wagon can be halted, shifted, whatever if need be.

@Lunar, pretty much the answer I was expecting :P. I was also uncomfortable with koromi's panic on day 1, a typical scum reaction IMO unlike NES's flipout.

In short, I'm convinced.
vote: koromi
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Budja on July 03, 2009, 15:53:20
Quote from: Lunar
That being said, voting for and killing a player is very different.
QFT

Quote from: Lunar
That being said, perhaps my pessimism, or rather my realism on the subject of attempting to higher the standard of Mafia on this forum is clouding my view of a better solution to the problem. If you have one, fire away.

It is tough as playing too strongly/aggressively seems to slow down the game a lot here.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 03, 2009, 16:00:04
QFT
Quad Ferat Temonstratum?

It is tough as playing too strongly/aggressively seems to slow down the game a lot here.
Indeed.
Although I wouldn't use the word strongly or aggresively.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: NESgamer190 on July 03, 2009, 16:01:05
After reading up on some of the posts, I've only a real inclination to speak to Razzorman.
About the theory of bored's death:  Being frank, as well as honest, I suspect another wagon is coming to try and make turfkill out of me, but I feel as though that wagon will not come this time, due to new data arrival.
Considering Budja's support to the Lunar theory, I will have to FOS Koromi (And remove my finger from everyone else I had, as I need most of them for typing), as much as I would want to vote Koromi, I'd be accused of a bandwagon and then become headless.  (Not to be negative, but I do not want to go through another near death.)  Koromi, not to sound crude or anything, but care to explain the small panic Budja and Lunar kindly mention?
@Lunar about QFT:  It abbreviates into Quote For the Truth.  It states the quote is quite solid in honesty.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: LimeLemon on July 03, 2009, 16:09:40
@LL, threatening lurkers with a lynch is sometimes necessary to lure them out. If they start contribution the wagon can be halted, shifted, whatever if need be.

@Lunar, pretty much the answer I was expecting :P. I was also uncomfortable with koromi's panic on day 1, a typical scum reaction IMO unlike NES's flipout.

In short, I'm convinced.
vote: koromi


What panic? Also, I don't think your role affects much how you react on a vote towards you. That's more a personal thing.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Budja on July 03, 2009, 16:16:24
@NES, if you find a player suspicious and worthy of a vote, then (in most cases) you should vote for them. Self-preservation is not really needed as town (been nightkilled is the best compliment the mafia can give you  ;)).

Do you actually find koromi scummy? Even if you find Lunar or myself pro-town, you should still look at koromi yourself.

Now we've probably scared everyone away with this burst of activity :P.

Preview Edit: @LL, koromi got quite stressed when I voted him early day 1. Your role does indeed affect your reaction to a vote. When I have played as scum, I generally find votes on me are quite unsettling. Scum have generally more to lose if they are lynched. Town PRs know they can claim to avoid a lynch and vanilla town know that they are innocent, so the case against them must be wrong in some way.
NES's reaction was also a bit suss. But that appears to be part of his personality than anything else.


Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: NESgamer190 on July 03, 2009, 16:20:40
@budja:
I honorably thought that the case of bandwagon overrides the hunt for scum somehow in some wierd paradox, and considering he did have a small panic, which may be showing he has a face card (so to speak), I've no real choice but to pull this off.  vote Koromi.  Better to die in a blaze of glory, than to die in eternal shame I say.  Also to note budja, you couldn't have gone closer to the truth with my stressful freakout.  I've mentioned once, maybe twice before, but I'll say again, I can safely assure you that I won't panic that way again.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 03, 2009, 16:26:46
What panic? Also, I don't think your role affects much how you react on a vote towards you. That's more a personal thing.

I disagree.
If I were a mafia and I saw three votes for me on day 2, I would react to it differently if I were a townie and I saw three votes for me on day 2 and I would react to it differently if I were a doctor and I saw three votes for me on day 2.
Although character does play quite a large role, role plays a much larger role, and more importantly, reactions from votes can give a fairly accurate clue, most of the time. I think this is pretty much agreed on by all, so I don't have to get into a classic Lunar long-winded post about it.
:3

I've only a real inclination to speak to Razzorman.
Go ahead then.

I suspect another wagon is coming to try and make turfkill out of me
What why? No votes on you, no good arguments against you. What why, I say!

but I feel as though that wagon will not come this time
Doesn't that contradict what you just said? Why are you putting on this illusion of self-uncofidence, anxiety and paranoia?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 03, 2009, 16:39:09
Considering Budja's support to the Lunar theory, I will have to FOS Koromi
So your personal opinion of the role of other, third players is based on the opinion of fourth players on said third player?

I would want to vote Koromi, I'd be accused of a bandwagon and then become headless.
Bandwagons (I haven't looked it up in a Mafia terminology actually I just have):

From MafiaWiki:
"Several Votes on the same player to try to Lynch them or force them to roleclaim; especially used if the votes come in quick succession and without independent reasons.

Bandwagons can be especially frustrating for players, because they can seem to build a momentum of their own. Independent of the validity of the original reasoning that started it. [...]

[...] It is especially dangerous during Lynch-or-Lose situations (where one misvote will make the town lose) and should be avoided at that point."

I'd like to point out that a bandwagon is dangerous and scummy because players can get a bit overexcited a vote a person into oblivion while ignoring new evidence on the way. We need 6 votes to lynch, we have 3. My votes are never set in stone, and neither should anybody else's be.
As long as those who already vote don't stubbornly keep their vote and as long as those who haven't voted don't vote due to a phenomenon kinda like peer pressure, then we will not fall victim to the momentum of a bandwagon.

So what I'm saying is, don't be silly.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 03, 2009, 21:56:59
Also, back to the events of N1.
We can safely assume that the SK/Mafia did not kill someone. From this two scenarios are derived. Either the target of a SK/Mafia hit was blocked, or the SK/Mafia were so inactive that Purple Pineapple decided to end N1.

@mod: Would you report it to us if the Mafia/SK tried to kill someone and failed?
@mod: Do you maintain a policy of restricting the length of nights if night roles aren't posted for a long time? If yes, would you report the utilization of such a restriction?

If and when further information comes to light, interesting things may happen.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: TechnoGeek on July 03, 2009, 22:15:02
alright.  it seems i can't leave for 36 hours without mafia post explosions  :O :ohnoes: :shocked: :whoa:

anyway, I must agree that koromi is acting unusually suspicious.  First being mega-scared about a vote against him, then not posting anything at all, is just plain fishy.

vote:koromi
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Purple Pineapple on July 03, 2009, 22:31:33
@mod: Would you report it to us if the Mafia/SK tried to kill someone and failed?
If either fails to kill, there is simply only one lynch. The only people ever to know why besides mafia/sk would be the doctor and maybe investigator.
@mod: Do you maintain a policy of restricting the length of nights if night roles aren't posted for a long time? If yes, would you report the utilization of such a restriction?
For now, the night roles will all be restricted. If actions aren't PMed, no action is taken.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Dataflashsabot on July 03, 2009, 22:34:02
Well, LimeLemon has not argued his case all that much, and he still seems upset by a perfectly legitimate lynch even after it being explained to him several times.
In all honesty, I am very suspicious of him.
vote:LimeLemon although I may change it.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 03, 2009, 23:16:35
anyway, I must agree that koromi is acting unusually suspicious.  First being mega-scared about a vote against him, then not posting anything at all, is just plain fishy.

You don't seem to be adding anything new though.
All this information was readily available to you but you only voted for koromi (pretty quickly provided your more skeptical outlook on D1), once all the pieces had been laid out by me and after two other people voted for Koromi. Why, do you think, is this?

@Data: Indeed Limelemon has not provided a proper argument on that issue. However, I am not sure that the fact that he dislikes the Igiari lynch actually makes him necessarily scummy. Would you like to explain why you feel it does?

@Shawn: We had a thing back early D2 a couple of pages back. I'd like you to comment on that when you post (sorry not enough sleep to remember the issue completely although I'm sure there's something worth commenting about :P)

@Limelemon: Yeah what do you think of a) the fact that your stance is not only minority, but in my view mostly wrong except in extreme cases of tactical weirdness which I'm only including as a fail-safe.

@Koromi: Yeah it's pretty obvious.

@Rest: Whaddayathink girls?

Also unvote for now because seriously, if Techno got a bit carried away and another person does then the mafia will have an easy lynch, if were wrong. I'd like to hear everyones reflected opinion on Koromi before. Also I'm going to sleep for about 12 hours and I don't want to come back to a lynch of Koromi after the town put in four votes and the mafia snicked in another two and got a lynch.
I am fine with a Koromi lynch but a) I'm not 100% confident and more importantly b) we can still garner alot from this day. I mean seriously, some guys haven't even posted yet and Koromi definately hasn't. I'm not say --

I'm rambling. G'dnitghtd.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 03, 2009, 23:18:44
@Limelemon: Yeah what do you think of a) [...]

(Doh)
And b) please give us a defence against Data vote. What say you about it? TELL MEEEEEEE
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: koromi on July 04, 2009, 00:01:16
In short, I'm convinced.
vote: koromi


am i honestly supposed to sit back and enjoy being lynched, because then the town will see i'm one of them?
also, lunar and budja seem to be ignoring people just going along with anything they say. posting but unnoticed.

who is more likely to be the mafia? people who attract attention due to their inactivity or people who hide from lynchers by "jumping on bandwagons" but not saying anything so radically different that they are noticed.

i'm ready to vote, but i'll go look through what's already happened to find enough evidence to do that.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 04, 2009, 11:34:30
am i honestly supposed to sit back and enjoy being lynched, because then the town will see i'm one of them?
No you're supposed to counter the pretty valid arguments against you. You have ignored all of the claims made against you. I'm gonna give you some slack to counter them. I'm talking, like, 24 hours. Maybe.

also, lunar and budja seem to be ignoring people just going along with anything they say. posting but unnoticed. 

Posts #202, #203: Inquiries of NES after suspicious behaviour in his post #201.
Posts #208: Inquiries of Techno after slight suspicious behaviour in his post #205.
Also my questions of Bored when he was totally agreeing with me D1.
:|

By the way all of the questions asked in posts #202, #203, #208 by me are yet unanswered, it would be awesome if you guys could help the town monumentally by answering.
c:

who is more likely to be the mafia? people who attract attention due to their inactivity or people who hide from lynchers by "jumping on bandwagons" but not saying anything so radically different that they are noticed.

I think that people who are totally inactive and also flip out when voted by one person, then follow to ignore arguments placed against them are probably the more suspicious ones.
Also I think it's kinda unfair to accuse all of those who are voting against you of bandwagoning. I (who I would assume you would accuse me of bandwagon starting) have taken ample measures against a bandwagon.

i'm ready to vote, but i'll go look through what's already happened to find enough evidence to do that.
I'd really like to hear who you find most suspicious/who you think we should lynch/who you think is mafia and generally all your positions on the game. I'd also like to hear your opinion on the N1 kill. Who did it do you think (Mafia or SK)? What were the motives behind the SK/Mafia killing him who they did?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 04, 2009, 11:52:07
Oh yeah and

@SK: If you continue killing random people (most likely to be townies) you will soon find that the town will succumb very quickly to the Mafia, and you will lose, as will the town.
It is in both of our interests for you to use your kills with extreme prudence and care.
If you go on killing innocents, as you do, and take out key members of the town (ie the most active), thus also making the hunt for a mafia difficult, you will find the you will lose as early as N3.

@Mod: What is the exact wording of the Mafia's win condition?
@Mod: Does the SK count as an innocent, a mafia, or neither, when calculating the Mafia's win condition?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: LimeLemon on July 04, 2009, 15:09:32
If we have the same rules as last round, the mafia wins when they equal or outnumber everyone else (townies and SK). SK counts as neither mafia or townie.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Purple Pineapple on July 04, 2009, 19:19:59
@Mod: What is the exact wording of the Mafia's win condition?
@Mod: Does the SK count as an innocent, a mafia, or neither, when calculating the Mafia's win condition?
Quote
Mafia Member

Every night you discuss with your partner who to lynch. I need a PM of confirmation from both of you unless one is inactive for over the time limit. Then, they are on shaky ground. You win when the mafia equal or outnumber the other roles.

Mafia Roleblocker

Every night you discuss with your partner who to lynch. I need a PM of confirmation from both of you unless one is inactive for over the time limit. Then, they are on shaky ground. You may also role block anyone each night by PMing me their name. You win when the mafia equal or outnumber the other roles.

Serial Killer

Every night you can kill one person by PMing me their name.  You win when you equal or outnumber the town. If it's you and a mafia member, you win. If it's you and a mafia roleblocker, the mafia wins.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 05, 2009, 09:45:27
Are you ignoring me Limelemon?
FOS: Limelemon

@Limelemon: Yeah what do you think of a) the fact that your stance is not only minority, but in my view mostly wrong except in extreme cases of tactical weirdness which I'm only including as a fail-safe...
And b) please give us a defence against Data vote. What say you about it? TELL MEEEEEEE
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: LimeLemon on July 05, 2009, 16:10:26
I don't think it's really necessary, but ok.

a) I don't give a **** about your view. Everyone disagrees with me, but I don't give a **** ****. I may be wrong, but I don't care. I just say what I think.

b) It's only one vote, sheesh. And he had pretty lame arguments, too.

Excuse me for my aggression, I woke up on the wrong side today.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 05, 2009, 16:16:44
You remind me of Salmoneous.
 :^^:
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 06, 2009, 16:43:39
Oh yeah
Koromi
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Razzorman on July 06, 2009, 16:47:03
I vote:  koromi for the same reasons as day 1, as nothing has changed.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: LimeLemon on July 08, 2009, 02:06:39
@Mod: Votecount, please?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Budja on July 08, 2009, 05:59:02
Votecount are in the first post. koromi is on L-1.

I think we have had as much discussion as we are going to get. Anyone care to hammer :P.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 08, 2009, 08:41:27
@mod: It would be awesome if you could in the votecounts state how many players aren't voting at the moment.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 2
Post by: LimeLemon on July 08, 2009, 15:34:11
Votecount are in the first post. koromi is on L-1.

I think we have had as much discussion as we are going to get. Anyone care to hammer :P.

Blahness! How could I miss that? Must be because I never look on the first page...

Anyway, to get this game going, I vote: koromi. You're probably right about him...
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Night 2
Post by: Purple Pineapple on July 08, 2009, 19:53:20
And day two is over!

As the town started to notice koromi acting suspiciously, the votes started coming in. And it would seems the town's luck was turning around.

koromi, Mafia member, lynched day 2

Night roles have until July 9, 19:00:00 to PM me their actions. The night ends officially July 10, 19:00:00.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Purple Pineapple on July 11, 2009, 04:20:58
The rooster crowed. The sun shone. A new day began for the small town in the valley.
What? You think I seem high spirited? Well most of you should be because shawnachu, serial killer, lynched night 2
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Budja on July 11, 2009, 08:41:54
The final votecount:

koromi (6): Budja, NESgamer190, TechnoGeek, Lunar_Tick, Razzorman, LimeLemon

Town: TechnoGeek, Razzorman, Lunar and NES.

No read: Kasran, Firecat

Dataflashsabot: not a bad case on Limelemon but didn't comment of the koromi wagon even when it was nearing a lynch.

vote Dataflashsabot

Judging by previous games, it is highly likely that the mafia still have a roleblocker. So I dont think there should be any claims yet unless you have a guilty or are in danger of bring lynched.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 11, 2009, 08:55:50
shawnachu, serial killer, lynched night 2
Bored2death, townsperson, throat slit night 1

It's clear that kills of N1 and N2 were committed by different people.
Since the Mafia attempted to kill me N1 but I was saved, it follows that:
a) Shawn was killed by the mafia
b) Bored was killed by the SK (Shawn)
Since there was no kill by the SK N2, it follows that:
c) The mafia's kills are resolved before the SK's kills.

I know, mostly irrelevant.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 11, 2009, 11:18:31
I told you guys lynching the inactive works.
Important: The role blocker blocked me last night so is still alive. Don't roleclaim.

The final votecount:
[...]

Although fairly accurate, your readings may fall into the trap of missing a mafia member. This is because you seem to absolve most members of the congregation because they voted Koromi. Explain why you believe NES, Techno and Razzor are town.

You have avoided claiming Limelemon is town. I agree in this. Every time I reread D2 he becomes more and more suspicious.

Dataflashsabot is probably the best choice at this point, but lets face it, lynching him prematurely with a bandwagon now is surely unwise. Budja, your rashness to lynch him is queer.

Oughtn't we first question Kasran, Firecat and Limelemon?

@Limelemon:
What were your reasons on holding your vote back from voting Koromi until the last moment? What eventually moved you to vote?

@Kasran, Firecat:
You reasons on not voting Koromi? Your reasons on not voting?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Budja on July 11, 2009, 11:34:04
@Lunar, Look at the first post :P. Only 1 left.

Also, you have essentually softclaimed a power role there. You had no real reason to do so as I had already mentioned the likelyhood of a roleblocker.

After modding the last two games, I saw how the mafia avoiding voting for their partners. Bussing (voting other mafia to look more townie or simular) pretty much never occurred. This makes me quite confident on those are the start of the wagon. Razzorman, while towards the end has been participating and making cases and so is looking reasonably town.

A vote is not a lynch. I guess I should be more careful to avoid bandwagons but I prefer to vote rather than FoS or a weaker equivalent.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 11, 2009, 11:50:58
@Lunar, Look at the first post :P. Only 1 left.
Huh?
Why do you direct me there?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Budja on July 11, 2009, 14:08:31
Quote from: Lunar
Although fairly accurate, your readings may fall into the trap of missing a mafia member.

Ah, I thought you meant missing an extra mafia member here. Misunderstanding.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Razzorman on July 11, 2009, 14:46:16
Dataflashsabot: not a bad case on Limelemon but didn't comment of the koromi wagon even when it was nearing a lynch.

vote Dataflashsabot

He did say this the first day though:
koromi... personally I think he's okay, he may have just not had anything to say on the matter that other people haven't said. As you point out, I was like that too, so I can understand.

It doesn't mean much, but he could have been trying to make koromi look less suspicious.
He has also been very silent throughout the entire game.
I'm not entirely sure if he is mafia though, so I'm only going to FOS for now.

@Data: Who are you the most suspicious of?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Dataflashsabot on July 11, 2009, 14:56:24
...hm. I'm thinking Lunar_Tick atm. He implied he has a power role as if it were nothing, which makes me think he wasn't scared of repercussions. I'm also suspicious of Budja voting (rather than FOSing) me based on me not commenting on koromi... I guess I'm too biased to objectively say anything there though :/
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: NESgamer190 on July 11, 2009, 15:47:23
According to what happened night 2, we are down to what appears to be a mafia goon and a roleblocker.  As for suspects, I've not a heavy inclination to vote yet, but Kasran, firecat, data, and budja's vote raises me to pay attention to them.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Razzorman on July 11, 2009, 15:57:19
According to what happened night 2, we are down to what appears to be a mafia goon and a roleblocker.
What are you talking about? There is only one mafia player left in the game.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: LimeLemon on July 11, 2009, 18:47:14
@Limelemon:
What were your reasons on holding your vote back from voting Koromi until the last moment? What eventually moved you to vote?

Well, at first I thought it was a silly idea to just vote a random inactive and all that... you tried to convince me I was wrong, but I wouldn't believe you. Not at first, but after a while I thought "Ok, maybe they are right, since so many say the same thing and stuff..." but I had also given up. I mean, it was 5 votes on koromi and only one more (on me, but I don't care about that 'cause it was just silly), so I just... gave up. When I looked at my previous posts, I realized how stupid it sounded (I understand why I seem suspicious if you look at the D2 posts). It made no sense anymore, so I admitted I was wrong and followed the crowd instead. And this time, it was lucky for the town.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: NESgamer190 on July 12, 2009, 00:38:02
What are you talking about? There is only one mafia player left in the game.
Care to explain why shawnachu died off?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Budja on July 12, 2009, 03:50:35
The mafia killed the SK. Also the first post confirms that their is only one left.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 12, 2009, 18:16:15
On Dataflashsabot:
...hm. I'm thinking Lunar_Tick atm. He implied he has a power role as if it were nothing, which makes me think he wasn't scared of repercussions.
Your argument, I believe, is baseless.
You accuse me of scumness by the claim of... recklessness? Recklessness is not a scumtell.
I haven't claimed, nor implied, I had a power role. The non-conspiracy-theorist interpretation is, in fact the true one, what irony! :P I was informed N1 that I was targeted by the mafia but did not die. I was obviously protected by the doctor, who thought that I was a townie.

I'm also suspicious of Budja voting (rather than FOSing) me based on me not commenting on koromi...
Even if you give a valid reason from not having anything to do with questioning koromi or doubting him even in the slightest up to now, I don't think you can accuse people who demand answers from the rest of the congregation for being scummy.

On LimeLemon:
followed the crowd instead.
...

And this time, it was lucky for the town.
Are you implying that you gambled by voting on Koromi, still unsure of his role? Or did you actually change your mind because you believed he was scum?
I think if you, and I quote, "followed the crowd" and voted for Koromi at the last moment still (according to you) unsure of his role, you are very suspicious.
I find it very probable for a panicked mafia, after seeing his partner going down in flames, casting the last vote in an attempt to clear his own name.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 12, 2009, 18:17:05
FOS: Dataflashsabot
@Dataflashsabot: Give me your view on, among other things, Limelemon, please.

FOS: Limelemon.
@LL: Give me your view on, among other things, Dataflashsabot, please.

At the moment Dataflashsabot looks more dubious than Limelemon.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: LimeLemon on July 12, 2009, 20:51:22
What's so suspicious about Data?
Calm down Lunar, you're overreacting on everything. Actually, you seem more and more suspicious when I look at your previous posts...
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 12, 2009, 21:23:36
Data looks like the prime target for a lynch due to D2 shenanigans. I thought... that was obvious.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: LimeLemon on July 12, 2009, 22:46:27
Data looks like the prime target for a lynch due to D2 shenanigans. I thought... that was obvious.
...Excuse me?

Also, first you FOS me for not trusting you and jumping on the koromi bandwagon.
Then, you FOS me because I finally decided to trust you and voted koromi.

What's wrong with you, man?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Dataflashsabot on July 12, 2009, 23:00:17
What 'day 2 shenanigans'?

LimeLemon seems trustworthy to me. You, Lunar_Tick, on the other hand, have been suspicious for a while now. You argue against joining bandwagons; in all honesty it seems to me like you're the one starting them, FOSing everybody under the sun for very little reason. It seems to me that you don't quite have the town's best interests at heart, and that even if you're on the town's side, you are being rather unhelpful.

I may change it, but: vote:Lunar_Tick
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 12, 2009, 23:03:14
Also, first you FOS me for not trusting you and jumping on the koromi bandwagon.
Then, you FOS me because I finally decided to trust you and voted koromi.
That is a greedy reduction.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: LimeLemon on July 13, 2009, 00:28:39
Lunar, you are pathetic. Have you already forgotten about that lurker thing? Firecat? Kasran? Why note vote on them?
FOS: Lunar_Tick
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 13, 2009, 10:14:58
What 'day 2 shenanigans'?
In short, trying to distance yourself from Koromi, lurking and ignoring me.

After finding that Koromi was exposed as mafia, you are the most suspicious, as discussed in some of my previous posts.

LimeLemon seems trustworthy to me.
Why do you feel this? This comes in complete contradiction with your post #207:

Well, LimeLemon has not argued his case all that much, and he still seems upset by a perfectly legitimate lynch even after it being explained to him several times.
In all honesty, I am very suspicious of him.
vote:LimeLemon although I may change it.

It's perfectly alright to completely change ones opinion on an issue, however, you went from one opinion which you still haven't given evidence for (i.e.: voting LL) to another opinion (i.e.: supporting LL). This is very suspicious as it seems that, instead of actually forming opinions on people, you seem to be ever changing sides and siding with the players just to save yourself.

You, Lunar_Tick, on the other hand, have been suspicious for a while now.
Could you bring some quotes in on this?

You argue against joining bandwagons; in all honesty it seems to me like you're the one starting them, [...]
I think I gave the definition of a bandwagon during D2 and clearly stated and implemented measures against them. I cannot be accused of starting a bandwagon D3 because I have not voted yet, nor supported wholeheartedly Budja's justified vote yet.

[...] FOSing everybody under the sun for very little reason.
Surely, not a scumtell, even if my FOSs were unjustified. If you wish to clarify the reasons of my FOS's you could easily ask, but you rather seem to be more intent than lynching me and getting on with it rather than actually examining me methodically.
Anyway, my multiple FOS (which have only nominal value) D2 was to jolt some interest into the game (I think it worked perfectly as you, Razzor and some other players injected their valuable opinions into the game).
My two FOS D3 I will explain later in this post.



Also, first you FOS me for not trusting you and jumping on the koromi bandwagon.
Then, you FOS me because I finally decided to trust you and voted koromi.
You gave no airtight argument neither for your original opinion on this matter, nor about why you changed opinion. That could be interpreted as scummy.


Lunar, you are pathetic.
Unnecessary putrefaction.

Have you already forgotten about that lurker thing? Firecat? Kasran? Why note vote on them?
It looks like you've got a selective memory LL. You seem to forget the contents of post #228. I have been the only player who has actually brought their inactivity (at least during D3) to the town's attention and have questioned them. They have ignored me, however.

I continue to support my position that lurker lynches are the best way to go unless (and I think if you re-read the thread you'll find that I have not only implied this important clause but actually stated it clearly) there is significant evidence which point in a differrent direction. At this late-ish day we have a somewhat adequate amount of evidence to talk about.

I have not forgetten about Kasran and Firecat, but things take priority don't you think?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Budja on July 13, 2009, 11:11:07
The strong OMGUS  (http://mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=Omgus)reactions from data/limelemon are interesting to say the least. Lunar's behaviour has been quite pro-town so far IMO. Generating conversation is good not anti-town.

Two most recent suss things.
LimeLemon deflect attention to lurkers. +scum
Data's sudden change of heart re. Limelemon. +scum

I want to lynch one of these then do a mass claim tomorrow.

(If you want to blame someone for bandwagonning you really should be looking at me :P. Personally I see nothing wrong with forming well-thoughtout bandwagons.)

Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Razzorman on July 13, 2009, 11:51:41
What 'day 2 shenanigans'?

LimeLemon seems trustworthy to me. You, Lunar_Tick, on the other hand, have been suspicious for a while now. You argue against joining bandwagons; in all honesty it seems to me like you're the one starting them, FOSing everybody under the sun for very little reason. It seems to me that you don't quite have the town's best interests at heart, and that even if you're on the town's side, you are being rather unhelpful.

I may change it, but: vote:Lunar_Tick
Interesting. You made a case against LL earlier in the game, and now you had a change of heart?
Why?
I'm not saying It's not OK to change your opinion on someone, but LL isn't looking very pro town at the moment.
Seeing as you have also been silent throughout the most of the game, and that you never said anything about the koromi bandwagon, I'm going to vote: Dataflashsabot.
                                 

Lunar, you are pathetic. Have you already forgotten about that lurker thing? Firecat? Kasran? Why note vote on them?
Because there isn't much evidence saying that they are mafia besides the inactivity.
This is how an inactive lynch works.

Inactive player lynched: turns out to be mafia=Yay!
Inactive player lynched: turns out to be town=Nothing lost, because they weren't helping us anyways.
Active player lynched: turns out to be mafia=Yay!
Active player lynched: turns out to be town=Suicide.

So lynching an inactive player is a win/almost win situation, while lynching an active player should only be done if they look like they are mafia. If you have an active player who looks like they are mafia, its a lot better to try to get him/her lynched, because its not a blind choice.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Dataflashsabot on July 13, 2009, 13:14:08
Inactive player lynched: turns out to be town=Nothing lost, because they weren't helping us anyways.
I would have to disagree. It's better than lynching an active player, but remember that the mafia's goal is to be equal to the number of townies- lynching any of our own is a huge problem, active or no.
I realize this seems to go against what I said:
Quote
and that even if you're on the town's side, you are being rather unhelpful.
But that's not the same thing- I very much suspect Lunar_Tick is not on our side.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Razzorman on July 13, 2009, 13:18:39
You are avoiding my question. Why do you think Lunar is suspicious, and how come you changed your mind about Limelemon?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Razzorman on July 13, 2009, 13:23:13
Mafia players will always have to lie, and or avoid explaining themselves to some extent whenever they are making a case against someone, because there is no way for them to tell the truth.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 13, 2009, 13:29:20
Dataflashsabot
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 13, 2009, 13:31:08
It takes 5 to lynch right?
Anyway NES: make an appearance, would you?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: LimeLemon on July 13, 2009, 15:13:30
I have already explained why I changed my opinion from defending koromi to voting him multiple times, do I really have to do it again?
But... there is one thing I haven't said earlier. One reason why i changed my vote was because I wanted the day to end. But I didn't want to say that, because everyone would blame me for wanting a quick lynch=being mafia... I'm sure they will now, too.
But I don't think anything would have changed if I didn't vote him. Someone else would just have done it, but maybe after a long time. Thus wasting time. And then you would have blamed me for being mafia because I protected koromi until the very end. But now you blame me because I changed opinion instead. After I found out koromi was mafia, I knew I was screwed, and it wouldn't matter what I had done in the previous day.
So go ahead, kill me if you want. But wait, Lunar is the only one who is 100% against me... Razzor also thinks I'm kinda scum, but Lunar really wants me killed. But both are now blaming Data the most, for protecting me. That's silly, do you think we two are mafia? There is only one mafia left.
I would guess that is Lunar. He is very aggressive compared to the last round when he was town, he is just using his smart-talk and the trust he gained last round as a mask.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Razzorman on July 13, 2009, 15:40:20
After I found out koromi was mafia, I knew I was screwed, and it wouldn't matter what I had done in the previous day.
So you were actually hoping for koromi to not be mafia?

But wait, Lunar is the only one who is 100% against me... Razzor also thinks I'm kinda scum, but Lunar really wants me killed. But both are now blaming Data the most, for protecting me.
That is not the reason I voted for Data.
I believe he is just agreeing with you to start a bandwagon against lunar, because so far, he has been the most outspoken player in the game.

I would guess that is Lunar. He is very aggressive compared to the last round when he was town, he is just using his smart-talk and the trust he gained last round as a mask.
Uhu... Read post  #128 (http://nifflas.ni2.se/forum/index.php?topic=990.msg11096#msg11096) and post #180 (http://nifflas.ni2.se/forum/index.php?topic=990.msg12986#msg12986) again.
Lunar was one of the first to suspect koromi. It makes no sense for a mafia member to actively try to lynch his/her partner.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 13, 2009, 16:03:01
I have already explained why I changed my opinion from defending koromi to voting him multiple times, do I really have to do it again?
Your last argument came off as inadequate and I wanted to point that out so it was clear that I expected a better explanation from you. Actually giving one is beside the point.

But wait, Lunar is the only one who is 100% against me... [...] but Lunar really wants me killed.
What?
At the moment Dataflashsabot looks more dubious than Limelemon.
Data looks like the prime target for a lynch [...]
Dataflashsabot
:|

@LL: I'm not that suspicious of you at the moment, by the method of deduction. Since I believe that Data is probably the second mafia member, I suppose you must be a very paranoid townie. Basically you made a couple of bad moved (which perhaps were out of your control) and now you've gone a little off the tracks of sane arguments. Yeah ok that was patronising. On the other hand, I might be wrong. Which is why I'm playing it safe and FOSing you. You also are keen on just attacking me for the sake of attacking, or at least for the sake of bolstering against your insecurity, which one could compare to NES' irrational behaviour D1.

I would guess that is Lunar. He is very aggressive compared to the last round when he was town, he is just using his smart-talk and the trust he gained last round as a mask.
I resent this.  :(
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Dataflashsabot on July 13, 2009, 16:17:05
I'm not sure what's happened that makes you believe I am the mafia member. You are taking over, starting bandwagons and being exceedingly argumentative. You must realise that that's a little bit suspicious?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Budja on July 13, 2009, 16:33:01

- Aggresion is NOT scummy.
- Arguing/debating is NOT scummy.
- Creating/following sensible bandwagons is NOT scummy.

These are actually PRO-TOWN and help us find scum.

By doing this both Lunar and Razzorman are looking pretty town to me.

Data has:
 - avoided discussing koromi.
 - done a illogical reversal on his decent Limelemon case.
 - OMGUSed Lunar. (not the biggest tell but there enough already)

Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Razzorman on July 13, 2009, 16:37:49
You are taking over, starting bandwagons and being exceedingly argumentative. You must realise that that's a little bit suspicious?
How is leading an open discussion suspicious? A mafia player would want the exact opposite.
If nobody is talking, nobody can bring up evidence, and votes will be random or baseless, which is much more to the favor of the mafia than the town.
And how has lunar "taken over" the game exactly?

I'm not sure what's happened that makes you believe I am the mafia member.
Really? Have you read out posts?

I hate to repeat myself, but you are avoiding my question, which is typically a mafia sign.
how come you changed your mind about Limelemon?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Razzorman on July 13, 2009, 16:44:42
@mod: Could you send some prods to the inactive players?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Dataflashsabot on July 13, 2009, 16:53:44
Because he's less suspicious than before, helpful, and being far more calm and sensible than you are. Thus 'trustworthy'.

I had not intended to avoid your question; I had assumed its answer was obvious based on my other posts.

I see two possibilities: Lunar_Tick is a very active townie who through no fault of his own is causing even more disrupt and arguments, or he is Mafia/SK. I'm sorry, but the latter seems more likely to me.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Budja on July 13, 2009, 17:05:00
Quote from: Data
Because he's less suspicious than before, helpful, and being far more calm and sensible than you are. Thus 'trustworthy'.
You think Limelemon is calm? Are you sure about that :P.
Quote from: Data
I see two possibilities: Lunar_Tick is a very active townie who through no fault of his own is causing even more disrupt and arguments, or he is Mafia/SK. I'm sorry, but the latter seems more likely to me.

Disrupt is good, it gets people out of their comfort zones and mafia REALLY don't like that. Look at koromi's reaction when I voted him day 1.


Quote from: Razz
@mod: Could you send some prods to the inactive players?
^this.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Razzorman on July 13, 2009, 17:10:36
I see two possibilities: Lunar_Tick is a very active townie who through no fault of his own is causing even more disrupt and arguments, or he is Mafia/SK. I'm sorry, but the latter seems more likely to me.
The SK is already dead, and lunar voted for koromi way to early to be mafia. Either that, or he is using an extremely weird strategy.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 13, 2009, 17:13:49
Things are a little fuzzy to me. I can't clearly define the reasons behind Data's vote for me, so could you state them concisely please Data.

I want to lynch one of these then do a mass claim tomorrow.
A good idea, theoretically. In practise though, a lot of the inactives wouldn't turn up, and that would give the mafia an extreme upper hand.
I'm totally up for this, but I want confirmation from every player before actually initiating such a move.

On a more general note, the processing of other players' quotes I do in my posts are supposed to be countered, unless they're agreed with. There are a lot of things which are unsettled, that's all I'm saying.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Dataflashsabot on July 13, 2009, 17:26:10
There's other talk here to be 'processed', and you do a lot of 'processing'. We have other things to do than constantly counter your constant accusations.

Lunar_Tick, I have already summarized them several times, but okay: You accuse, you argue, you do all the things that are expected in a game of Mafia, but you are doing them a lot and often seemingly randomly. There's nothing wrong with being active, but you're constantly switching sides and making accusations for the simplest of things. Ease up a bit and look at things in a calmer manner.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Budja on July 13, 2009, 17:28:43
No need to rush into a mass-claim tomorrow. We can discuss it then, wait for inactives (I'm sure it wouldn't be too hard to get a quick "I'm <rolename>" post) or whatever is necessary.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Razzorman on July 13, 2009, 20:02:10
We have other things to do than constantly counter your constant accusations.
Like what? He isn't the only one talking, and I don't see why you would get so stressed over a couple of questions. Unless you are mafia of course. Then it makes sense.

Lunar_Tick, I have already summarized them several times, but okay: You accuse, you argue, you do all the things that are expected in a game of Mafia, but you are doing them a lot and often seemingly randomly. There's nothing wrong with being active, but you're constantly switching sides and making accusations for the simplest of things. Ease up a bit and look at things in a calmer manner.
Examples please?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: TechnoGeek on July 13, 2009, 22:11:46
too many pages of discussion to quote... <_<
anyway, I will vote:Dataflashsabot and FOS:LimeLemon

Data because of (a) inactivity and (b) suspecting Lunar for being mafia/SK. in the past...25 or so pages, he [Lunar] has been very helpful in summarizing and starting discussions. I don't think there is any way he could be mafia.

LimeLemon because his reaction was similar to koromi's about being lynched.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: LimeLemon on July 13, 2009, 23:38:16
Ok, sure, I confess. I am the mafia. And the SK. At the same time. I'm also a new, secret role: The SprünkelDünkel Knight! KILL ME!
Sorry, I'm going a little insane here... it's just that I give up. Whatever I try to say... just makes my situation worse. And you guys don't want to believe me anyway. And I'm not used to writing this many posts, and everyone questioning me all the time, it just makes me nervous and frustrated and will make my posts bad. Seriously, Lunar have ruined mafia. Look how many innocents inactives (wow that was a major typo). I remember the very first round... it was vote here and vote there, but it was fun. And one mafia day didn't take more than maybe 48 hours. And your eyes didn't bleed because you had to read so much stuff.
But Lunar came with his FOS:ing, and his careful voting, and über townie tips, and blamed everyone who didn't follow them to be mafia. This game isn't fun anymore, it's like a political debate!

Oh, and I agree with what Lunar said earlier... that I'm kinda like Salmoneous now. Blahness, I'm out. And don't expect me to post much more.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 14, 2009, 00:02:30
(http://img199.imageshack.us/img199/7886/oic.gif)
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: NESgamer190 on July 14, 2009, 00:03:54
Seeing all the posts, I somewhat lost count of the votes, and before I go making a fatal mistake, I would have a bit of appreciation if there was anyone who was 1 vote from the guillotine.
Either way, I've seem to have narrowed things down to limelemon and dataflashsabot.  As for who I am not fond of more, I have no idea how to determine, except that Limelemon is definitely not the serial killer, and the mafia (paradox #1), and the sprunkelDunkel knight, from the works of his post.  (I've been in his position once before.)
Verdict:  I've to give the evil eye to dataflashsabot.  The ONLY reason I am not voting is to avoid accidental lynching.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: Budja on July 15, 2009, 04:59:31
The ONLY reason I am not voting is to avoid accidental lynching.
How about you vote so we can get a purposeful lynch.

I am very happy with the data wagon and I want a lynch now.

@Limelemon, Mafia has always been a debate/argument based game. It's just that we are trying to bring a higher level of play here. Once PM's were forbidden, the town have to debate or die. It a lot more fun if you relax and don't get too paranoid about it.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 3
Post by: NESgamer190 on July 15, 2009, 15:05:36
@budja:
Well, if you insist...
Data, much as I like ya on the forum, I've to vote Dataflashsabot.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Night 3
Post by: Purple Pineapple on July 15, 2009, 15:32:50
That's a lynch!

Dataflashsabot, townie, lynched day 3

Night actions must PM by July 16, 15:00:00
The night ends July 17, 15:00:00
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Night 3
Post by: Razzorman on July 16, 2009, 17:48:12
I know I'm not supposed to post during the night, but I guess I have to.
I'm on a car trip through Germany right now, so I won't be able to post for about ten days or so, until I get back. :S
Sorry, but I didn't think the first day would last for so long.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 4
Post by: Purple Pineapple on July 18, 2009, 05:12:45
Oh. Sorry about being tardy.

Kasran, townsperson, killed night 3

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 4
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 18, 2009, 10:13:26
Oh, could you post a complete player list with all the dead players as well (with their time of death and role) on the first page and/or on your current posts. Thanks.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 4
Post by: Budja on July 18, 2009, 10:20:11
Just for reference here are the current players alive.

- Budja
- LimeLemon
- Lunar_Tick
- Razzorman
- Firecat
- NESgamer190
- Technogeek

I think a mass claim is our best play for today (i.e. we pick an order and everyone claims their role/any results in that order). Speak up if you think otherwise.


Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 4
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 18, 2009, 15:04:43
Hm. I'm not convinced that this is a good idea. I was under the impression that there were at most 5 players left in the game (due to inactivity on their part) and in that case I would be for a massclaim.
But in the current situation I am not fully in favour of a massclaim.
The roles in play are a doctor, a seer, a mafia and four innocents, assuming that PP didn't chuck in some secret flavour roles (which we would get the whiff of by now if they existed, so they most likely don't).
Therefore we aren't really going to earn much. All we will be doing is outing the seer and the doctor, while the mafia will certainly claim vanilla town, as with another four real townies. We would be hindering the inno power roles' actions unless we actually end this day with a successful lynch.
So I think we should wait till tomorrow or the day after tomorrow to perform such a move. For now, I think we should go about behaving normally.


Where the shizznazz is Firecat.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 4
Post by: Budja on July 18, 2009, 15:42:37
Well maybe it is a little early, but it would be good for the town to actually get results for once.

How about this.
---
If the cop have a guilty, they should claim now.
If the cop has all 3 successful results on still living players, they should claim now.
Else don't claim.
---

Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 4
Post by: NESgamer190 on July 18, 2009, 17:00:35
Well budja, that's a lovely idea, but suppose the cop will not give results in fear of being held false and gets hung?  As for votes, I've nobody to vote quite yet until one of two things happen:
1:  The cop goes ahead and roleclaims under circumstances.
2:  some other information is leaked somehow.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 4
Post by: TechnoGeek on July 18, 2009, 17:49:50
I am the investigator.
results:
n1: nesgamer=town
n2: budja=town
n3: LimeLemon=mafia, lynching Kasran

vote:LimeLemon, obviously
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 4
Post by: Budja on July 18, 2009, 17:55:02
Nice.
Vote Limelemon
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 4
Post by: NESgamer190 on July 18, 2009, 17:56:14
Well played TechnoGeek.
Vote Limelemon.  BURN IN HECK mafioso!  (couldn't resist saying it)
however, if that is wrong, yer the prime suspect.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 4
Post by: TechnoGeek on July 18, 2009, 18:17:53
Well played TechnoGeek.
Vote Limelemon.  BURN IN HECK mafioso!  (couldn't resist saying it)
however, if that is wrong, yer the prime suspect.
I am 100% sure unless the moderator is wrong somehow XD
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Day 4
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 18, 2009, 18:19:19
I was gonna do the omg lets think this through routine but we've got 2 tries to lynch before we have a lynch or lose situation.

So Limelemon
blame the hammering on me.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: Purple Pineapple on July 18, 2009, 18:58:22
Town Victory

And so, Day 4 was over before it began. Once the investigator piped up, it was over before the last remaining mafia member had a chance to defend himself. Game summary:

Day 1
town lynches Igiari (town)

Night 1
shawnachu(SK) slits the throat of Bored2death(town)
koromi(maf) and LimeLemon(MRB) attempt to kill Lunar_Tick(Doc)
Lunar_Tick(Doc) protects himself
LimeLemon(MRB) roleblocks Firecat(town)
TechnoGeek(Inv) investigates NESgamer190(town)

Day 2
town lynches koromi(maf)

Night 2
shawnachu(SK) doesn't kill anyone
TechnoGeek(Inv) investigates Budja
Lunar_Tick(Doc) protects himself
LimeLemon(MRB) kills shawnachu(SK) and roleblocks Lunar(Doc)

Day 3
town lynches Dataflashsabot(town)

Night 3
Lunar_Tick(Doc) protects himself
LimeLemon(MRB) kills Kasran(town) and roleblocks Lunar_Tick(Doc)
TechnoGeek(Inv) investigates LimeLemon

Day 4
town lynches LimeLemon(MRB)

still alive:

Budja
Lunar_Tick (Doc)
Razzorman
Firecat
NESgamer190
T3c4n0g33k (Inv)
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 18, 2009, 19:49:12
Good game everyone.
Big kudos to budja and razzor for soundness of arguments.

Woohoo lets analyze for future metagaming
@Lime: was your flipout some game tactic or?
@Data: wtf man.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: Dataflashsabot on July 18, 2009, 20:52:54
Wtf indeed.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: NESgamer190 on July 18, 2009, 22:25:33
All I can say, is that third game's the charm I suppose...  *lets off a sigh of relief the mafia is extinct*
they had me foiled for a bit, but it proved futile in the end.  good try mafia.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: TechnoGeek on July 18, 2009, 22:37:49
Night 2
Lunar_Tick(Doc) protects himself
LimeLemon(MRB) roleblocks Lunar(Doc)

Night 3
Lunar_Tick(Doc) protects himself
LimeLemon(MRB) roleblocks Lunar_Tick(Doc)

wow... XD
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 18, 2009, 22:40:28
What's the thang?

I'm assuming they thought I was the investigator?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: LimeLemon on July 19, 2009, 01:02:42
Yes, because you were so 100% against me all the time I was afraid you were the investigator, and if you were killed everyone would have got me lynched.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: koromi on July 19, 2009, 01:31:34
i thought you couldn't protect yourself as the doctor.
well, nevermind.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: Budja on July 19, 2009, 02:57:24
Woo.

Kudos to LimeLemon. You convinced me you were prob town in the end with that outburst.
Also nice scumhunting from Lunar and Razzor.
And nice finish by Techno.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: Bored2death on July 19, 2009, 03:01:13
Nice job... wish I could have been there... glad the town actually won, though! So... when's the next game start?
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: Lunar_Tick on July 19, 2009, 09:25:52
you were so 100% against me all the time.
:|
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: LimeLemon on July 19, 2009, 14:34:48
Well, Lunar, it felt like that at least. That's why I flipped out at the end.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: NESgamer190 on July 19, 2009, 19:57:49
I'll be willing to mod the next mafia, but I'm going to wait until monday or tuesday (depending on how lazy I get) until the sign ups begin.  [reason behind the delay before sign ups is to give you all, and myself a breather from the intense game]
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: Shawnachu on July 19, 2009, 21:02:36
I can host if NES can't.
Title: Re: Mafia 3 - Town victory
Post by: Purple Pineapple on July 20, 2009, 02:39:50
NES just said he could.