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Temporary => Knytt Stories Level Releases => Topic started by: EarthBound015 on June 25, 2013, 03:36:51

Title: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: EarthBound015 on June 25, 2013, 03:36:51
Just because you think you know someone, doesn't mean you actually do... Not until you dig a little deeper into their psyche, that is.  What they've done, who they've done it to.  You'd never know about some people....



Well, here it is for all of you good people!  It isn't very long or anything, short and to the point, I guess.  There is a secret area somewhere if you feel so inclined to locate it.  I wanted to make this a lot bigger than it is and include different endings and such.  But man, I don't have the time to even work on something this small! 

Anyhoo!  Do your best to enjoy it! :)

Screenshots located at http://nifflas.lpchip.nl/index.php?topic=6019.0 (http://nifflas.lpchip.nl/index.php?topic=6019.0)

Spoiler: Mediafire Download (click to show/hide)

Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: pfrangip on June 25, 2013, 15:52:35
Can't wait to play this when I get home tonight! Looks great!
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: Talps on June 25, 2013, 16:37:03
Fun challenges, though the music loop got really annoying in the first challenge screen so I was glad for the brief respite from it that the secret area provided (the secret area was cool but I felt that its mood was really too different from that of the rest of the level). Ending was disappointingly miserable, which is a shame 'cus I did enjoy it until then; the end will put a lot of people off liking it, I think.
However, graphics were really nice and worked well. Your COs were great. In-game cutscenes were well-made and looked very cool.

Apart from the music and the miserable ending, it was a fun, slick little level. Chance of redemption, please!
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: egomassive on June 25, 2013, 22:31:03
Good level. The challenges were too difficult for my liking. I couldn't pass the very last part without cheating, but it's lunatic so I'm surprised I passed any of it. Haven't found the secret yet. The design and the story telling were well done. I thought the ending was acceptable.
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: EarthBound015 on June 26, 2013, 02:12:42
Thanks, guys!

Talps, all my secret areas in any of my levels (at least the ones with secret areas, which might be all of them besides Insurance) are usually lighthearted or a breath of fresh air from the story of the game.  I dunno, I always thought that's what a secret area should be.  :)  And the ending is the way it is for a couple of reasons:
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)

egomassive,
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)

So yeah!  :)  Thanks again guys!
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: Chrysophylax on June 27, 2013, 14:00:25
How in the name of BAGELS do you get past the screen with the red spikey thing that chases you? Normally I'm good at challenges like that, but nothing I try will get me up the first section.
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: EarthBound015 on June 27, 2013, 14:47:17
Are you talking about the first red spikey screen?  That one just takes speed and precision. If you're talking about the second one, a little patience will go a long way at the very start of the screen. And the third is a mixture of both. :)
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: Raicuparta on June 27, 2013, 16:08:50
How in the name of BAGELS do you get past the screen with the red spikey thing that chases you? Normally I'm good at challenges like that, but nothing I try will get me up the first section.
Jump repeatedly to climb faster. Also it might help to wait for the thing to get close to you before going back up in those parts where you keep going up and down.

I think this was the first lunatic level I ever completed without cheating, I'm quite proud, even though I died like 50 times.

Really liked this level, actually think it was the right length, I'd probably give up if it was much longer. My favorite sections where the "red spikey things" rooms, there was just so much tension when that bloody thing was 2 pixels away from Adriana, I almost destroyed my S key from too much jumping :P And I especially enjoyed this one (http://i.imgur.com/DRs2es4.png), it required both speed and perfect timing.
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: Fubaka on June 27, 2013, 17:57:05
Hello, James!  Glad to see you are making levels again!

This level was a bit shorter than I thought it would be, and while some of the challenges were indeed head-bashingly hard, I got through most of them pretty quickly.
The message is one that resonates with me personally, though I have never made a mistake so huge it ruined someone's life. (and I hope I never will)

On a lighter note, I will say that:

Spoiler: (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: EarthBound015 on June 27, 2013, 19:48:59
Raicuparta, I think the red spikey things were my favorite rooms as well.  Although, I really enjoyed the first room as well.  I'm glad you enjoyed it and felt the need to finish it!  Makes me proud my level is interesting enough to warrant people to finish it. :)

Fubaka, if I do make another level, it wont be for a long while.  I dunno, I just felt the need out of nowhere to make a KS level just because.  Maybe I wanted an outlet to push a story out or something.  :)  Yeah, I was going to make it longer, but I knew I wasn't going to have enough time to actually finish it, so this is what came out of the huge story I had planned, lol.  And remember, mistakes are only mistakes if you don't learn from them.  Learning experiences :D  And yeah, I always thought the same thing as you and was waiting for someone to bring it up, lol.  Even with Lament where the CO first made an appearance I always thought, all she's gotta do is jump through the holes!  XD
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: pfrangip on June 28, 2013, 03:50:24
Played it through no problem, no cheating. I LOVED the auto-saves and the frequent saves, THANK YOU for that. Too often do people put saves further apart in order to increase "challenge" when in reality that just increases player stress.

The Red Spikies weren't too hard for me, but then again, I play Monochromatic Gotta as my usual Knytt Stories warmup.

The story was certainly Emo, but that's fine, I liked it enough. I loved the evil, dreadful feel of the entire level... there's not enough of that in KS. Take a star.


EDIT: Found the secret, and liked it. Only wish it didn't end so soon! Maybe make leaving the secret level optional?
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: EarthBound015 on June 28, 2013, 13:56:41
pfrangip,

A Lunatic level (or any level for that matter) shouldn't be based on "Oh man, you have to do this whole section without messing up once or else you have to go back 3 screens and do it all over again."  XD

Hah, I like how the use of "Emo" has turned into a catchall for all things dark and "unforgiving" for lack of a better word and that some people intertwine it with "Goth."  I always thought "Emo" was "Emotional" as in, the sad Country music of the rock genre.  Iono, I guess I'm just rambling now.

About the secret area, I just like trying to make KS do things that most people wouldn't think about doing for my secret areas.  Something just out of the ordinary and strange.  Although, I do believe Lament had a pretty straight-forward secret area just with talking in most of the rooms.  I was thinking about making the song longer or having it loop, but man, was I getting bored.  I also didn't want it to get too repetitive.  Not to mention I wanted to keep everything straight forward with simple switches.  I guess I could make a, "Would you like to do it again" type o' thing, but I doubt I'll even do that :\ If there arn't any bugs or anything like that, I doubt I'll do anything to this level again. 

Thanks for playing :)
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: Comhon on June 28, 2013, 22:04:08
Very interesting level. My second lunatic level I have played yet (The first was mine).
My favorite challenge is the final with the flying spikes.
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: Pumpkinbot on July 29, 2013, 07:23:33
I agree with pretty much everyone else here. xP Loved the screens with the red spikey dude! Especially the first one!

None of the screens felt too hard for me, though all of them presented a pretty fun challenge. :)

I give this level a rating of A/5
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: ixMarcel on July 29, 2013, 16:43:46
It is great. You did the creepy and mysterious atmosphere very well! Really cool level  :).
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: EarthBound015 on July 31, 2013, 00:16:56
Thanks guys!  Glad to hear all of you liked it!  If I had the time, I'd go all out and make longer levels like my older ones, but man.  Busy James is busy!
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: plural on August 18, 2013, 07:06:21
I loved the art and the style. The story was certainly resonant. And the way the level was put together was really cool. I'm not very good so I did have to cheat in the editor to finish the last challenge room but I'm absolutely terrible at Knytting.  The repetitious music didn't really bother me but I started to get a headache from playing it with the desktop blacked and the white screen flashing because I kept dying so much. And anyway,
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)

So, to continue, these aren't complaints but more a bit of advice (should anyone care, or you if you ever make another level) and these are based on my own findings having done the exact same things. To that end, they're certainly not bugs or errors just things to make a level more solid and smooth.
When you do a sticky shift, make sure you use a square type shift because you can nudge yourself into not being able to use the shift. I had to restart at the last save once because of the spot shift on the first interlude with dialogue because I got stuck having moved awkwardly into the sticky spot.
Also, if you can, using layer 2 as a redundant image of the overlaying 6/7 custom objects means that things won't pop into each screen. I mean it's certainly inevitable that you can't do something like that for the moving clouds (nice touch, by the way) but the bars through the level could have been done with a redundant image of the bars at layer 2 and then moving through screens means when they pop in it's much less noticeable if it is at all.

I'm not suggesting you do these things just some advice to anyone who's making levels. Again, good level.
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: EarthBound015 on August 18, 2013, 19:14:41
Thanks for playing and analyzing, plural!  I'll be sure to take your advice, especially on the sticky shift situation, if I do ever make another level.  And I can see where you're coming from with the bars, but man, I was already tired of working on the level, lol.  I was going to have this be a pretty big world in which you had three areas to choose from and which ever you chose gave you a different ending, but I just couldn't find time and the want to do it after I started it.  So I just did what I know I'm decent at, making a lunatic level.  lol

Thanks again!
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: GrayFace on October 11, 2013, 17:15:27
Fine level. It didn't feel Lunatic to me, more like Very Hard.
Spoiler: Bugs (click to show/hide)
The COs revealed a KS bug - they stop appearing after some number of screen switches.

How in the name of BAGELS do you get past the screen with the red spikey thing that chases you? Normally I'm good at challenges like that, but nothing I try will get me up the first section.
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)

And I especially enjoyed this one (http://i.imgur.com/DRs2es4.png), it required both speed and perfect timing.
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: egomassive on October 12, 2013, 15:12:32
The COs revealed a KS bug - they stop appearing after some number of screen switches.
I dug into this. KS 1.2.1 leaks memory at an alarming rate when COs are in use. I created a level where Juni could fall through two screens and Warp back to the top. These screens had a total of 45 COs between them. My task manager revealed that KS was increasing memory usage by 12 MB per minute! I also tested the latest mods. KS+ leaked 0.2 MB in the same test, and KSEx leaked 12 MB.

I didn't see the failure myself, but I remember seeing it before with a different level. It seems the only way to reset the memory usage is to close the program and reopen it. Deaths, Cutscenes, and Resets don't fix it.
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: GrayFace on October 12, 2013, 19:22:07
Turns out Animated Picture object's Destroy doesn't free stuff. I wonder why your mod eats up only 2MB. Might be MMF2 version, mine is really dated.
Edit: Found the answer: http://nifflas.lpchip.nl/index.php?topic=2542.10 (last post)
My Animated Picture version was older. The new one doesn't leak :)
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: egomassive on October 14, 2013, 00:03:45
@GrayFace: I couldn't say which version of the extension I used, but the MMF2 I used was old. I had a lot of trouble updating it, and when I finally succeeded it was incompatible with my extension library. :sick: Oh, the leak was only 0.2 MB in KS+.

I did some more testing. KS 1.2.1 stops displaying COs at around 5000 objects, but it continues to leak memory as if they were working. KS+ climbed to over 10K objects without failure, at which point I was too bored to wait any longer.
Title: Re: [Challenge][Lunatic] - Caged In
Post by: GrayFace on October 14, 2013, 01:13:50
KS+ probably uses the last version of that extension. Anyway, the issue is now fixed in my WIP version as well.