Nifflas' Support Forum

Temporary => Knytt Stories Level Releases => Topic started by: egomassive on November 20, 2012, 09:40:15

Title: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: egomassive on November 20, 2012, 09:40:15
Dear Juni, My land has fallen into an unending winter. I need your help. - Mrs. Soup

Endless Winter is a round robin level over two years in the making. Many many people have played a part in its development. Foremost of these are Bulbapuck who started and led the project early on, Headgrinder who kept things going in the middle, and Sergio Cornaga and myself who have finalized it.

The collaborative aspect has given the level a slightly eclectic feel. However, the story and the winter theme tie it all together nicely. The gameplay is mostly easy environmental, but there are several points where players can choose a hard challenging path.

Get Endless Winter by the Nifforum (http://egomassive.com/2013/05/endless-winter/)
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: sergiocornaga on November 20, 2012, 10:23:16
Oh boy, I know what I'm doing tonight.

EDIT: This was great, you tied everything together quite nicely! That last area was really spooky, and I admire how you snuck in Healy's Lab 1 idea. Have a :hiddenstar:!
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: Purple Ink on November 20, 2012, 11:15:50
This was a fantastic level! I especially liked the cutscenes and

Spoiler: (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: CWolvie on November 20, 2012, 17:25:13
Excellent level.  XD
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: Talps on November 21, 2012, 00:51:00
Phew, that was good fun! Very nice atmosphere most of the way through. The only let-down was the future area (which was a big let down, if I'm honest - way below the standard of the rest of the level).

But it was good. Graphics, audio, plot and script were very good. I wish I'd dropped in on Mrs Soup a few times more - only noticed her dialogue later on.

I got very lost looking for Lab 1 - managed to find a floating painter first (I'm too lazy to insert spoiler tags so I'm talking in riddles instead). Got there in the end but other likely entries were more memorable than the actual solution, and the map made it look like its entrance was somewhere in or left of Lab 4.

Overall, a lot of fun. Very good level. Well done, all!
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: egomassive on November 21, 2012, 03:15:41
I'm glad you're all enjoying it. Thanks for the stars. I don't feel the least bit guilty for reaping all the rewards from this community made level.  >)

Yes, Talps, the future defied tie-ins. The story was developed around what people had added, not an easy task. Then, small respectful design changes brought it all together. The Greenfire Road was so out there that we couldn't make it fit without completely destroying the authors work.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: powderj on November 21, 2012, 05:25:43
I'm trying to install this in Ego's mod and I keep getting a file corrupt error.  I deleted the original "world" folder for one of the previous versions and the error is still occurring.  Any ideas?  Thanks.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: sergiocornaga on November 21, 2012, 11:03:07
Got there in the end but other likely entries were more memorable than the actual solution, and the map made it look like its entrance was somewhere in or left of Lab 4.

Sorry, that's mostly my doing! The map thing is basically a red herring aside from indicating the rough location.

I'm trying to install this in Ego's mod and I keep getting a file corrupt error.  I deleted the original "world" folder for one of the previous versions and the error is still occurring.  Any ideas?  Thanks.

I installed it with Ego's mod and it was fine, so I'm guessing the download corrupted. Have you tried redownloading?
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: egomassive on November 21, 2012, 13:26:47
I'm trying to install this in Ego's mod and I keep getting a file corrupt error.  I deleted the original "world" folder for one of the previous versions and the error is still occurring.  Any ideas?  Thanks.
Just now, I successfully downloaded it and installed it myself. So, re-downloading should fix your problem. The exact file size is 23,809,367 bytes. It is probably my fault that your download corrupted. I uploaded a new version near the time stamp on your comment. (I had misspelled misalign. :oops: )

It may be worth mentioning that some of the npc COs have randomized animations when you play with KS+. Original KS users get looping animations.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: GrayFace on November 21, 2012, 14:11:10
That's just what I wanted to ask. I thought I read that you used the area ambiance objects, but couldn't find it in that thread when checking.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: Dj Gopher on November 22, 2012, 01:42:39
Downloading now...
Looking forward!
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: Widget on November 23, 2012, 01:29:41
It may be worth mentioning that some of the npc COs have randomized animations when you play with KS+. Original KS users get looping animations.

I decided, on balance, to add this level to "the list (http://nifflas.lpchip.nl/index.php?topic=5133.0)" for this reason but with an explanatory note.
As an aside, if I can be forgiven for going briefly OT,  I could use some feedback on how to advertise updates to the topic aswell, should anyone have an opinion and a spare few minutes  ;)

Back on-point, though; I've really enjoyed this level. The cutscenes look great and really work wonders to tie everything together. All your hard work on it has really paid off in a big way. :hiddenstar:
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: Fubaka on November 23, 2012, 15:24:45
Excellent level!  I very much liked the atmosphere it built in the laboratories, and the music was very well chosen!

A few things I'd like to bring up though.

Spoiler: (click to show/hide)

Still, this level is definitely a keeper in my collection, and I'll probably do a full review of it soon.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: ixMarcel on November 23, 2012, 15:54:20
I have to agree: "Future" area is one big fail. Rest of the level is fantastic  C).
edit: I foud secret area!
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: Polana on November 24, 2012, 11:42:44
Wow !
That was amazing !
I especially liked cutscenes and the part you can swim - it is really unusual feeling to swim in KS.
And scenic/easy path in the cave with keys looks beautiful.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: GrayFace on November 27, 2012, 15:46:13
Awesome level :)

Snow in snow overlay was too big. Walking through these snowy screens was unpleasant.

As an aside, if I can be forgiven for going briefly OT,  I could use some feedback on how to advertise updates to the topic aswell, should anyone have an opinion and a spare few minutes  ;)
One thing I always do is leave a post in the topic describing the changes.

Wall-swim in the attachment.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: egomassive on November 27, 2012, 21:40:38
New version available. There are only very minor fixes included. One screen in lab 3 had the wrong music. The screen with the wallswim GrayFace found has been altered. Some backgrounds near the icicle caves improve the transition from the town. The link in the opening post is current, but if you've already downloaded before today you can install the following patch:

Download Endless Winter patch (http://egomassive.com/temp/Nifforum-EndlessWinterPatch.knytt.bin) 257 KB
Warning! This is not the full level. Install this over the level only if you had it before 27 November 2012.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: ixMarcel on November 27, 2012, 21:57:44
There's speedrun of this level: Endless Winter Speedrun (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_UXBzCbOrk). Enjoy...
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: sergiocornaga on November 28, 2012, 16:50:32
New version available. There are only very minor fixes included. One screen in lab 3 had the wrong music. The screen with the wallswim GrayFace found has been altered. Some backgrounds near the icicle caves improve the transition from the town.

Backgrounds are quite an improvement! If you decide to touch up this level again, I noticed this SGE (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v229/sergiocornaga/endlesswintersge.png). Shift sounds could probably also be made more consistent, but I know I wouldn't wanna attempt that...
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: StraightFlame on December 29, 2012, 21:07:43
"I've heard there are statues in the Halls of Ice with the power to shift time itself!"

- Me, apparently, despite the fact that i don't remember saying that at all.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: sergiocornaga on December 29, 2012, 22:02:07
After reading that you'd swapped the sprite in Linear Greenfire road with one of yourself, but not seeing any evidence of this in downloaded levels, I set out to do that myself. It turned out to be pretty troublesome, so I settled for adding your sprite elsewhere. Do you object? I had very mixed feelings about it after adding it.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: StraightFlame on December 29, 2012, 22:20:37
Do you object? I had very mixed feelings about it after adding it.

Nah. The generic other guy i used before that looked pretty awesome, and didn't have the problem of being a shameless self-insert. That's the nice part about the recast; if you DO know where the sprite came from, it's still only a cameo and not a "real" self-insert.



Speaking of Greenfire Road...

The only let-down was the future area (which was a big let down, if I'm honest - way below the standard of the rest of the level).
Yes, Talps, the future defied tie-ins.
I have to agree: "Future" area is one big fail.

Designer of the future area here. Yes, i know it sucks, and i somewhat regret ever having made it.

I was the least experienced guy working on this level. I experimented with the editor before, but this was my first attempt at a platforming challenge (not that it was supposed to be that much of a challenge anyway). I also had a lot to do in the week i was supposed to work on this, and i also wanted to make another lab besides the one that already existed (Lab 4, with the exception of some changes made by others, is mine). As for the purpose: I think the Greenfire Road was intended to be a way to get out of the Halls of Ice. It quickly became redundant when someone had the [sincerity]awesome idea[/sincerity] to make the elevator also go up, something i couldn't do back then, and still can't do now. It slowly (read: quickly) became more and more (read: absolutely) useless, and all i could do is hope someone would give it some purpose, even if they just put a "secret area" label on it. Needless to say, that never happened.

I also want to apologize for the fact that this formed a big problem in the creation of this level. Also, thanks for keeping it in; the fact that you did nothing about this huge stain on an otherwise perfect level means a lot to me... i guess.

Edit: Also, the fact that you made my random little NPC in the lab a ridiculously important character. Whoever came up with the "wood/Wood" thing is a genius.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: egomassive on December 30, 2012, 00:10:41
Don't let it get you down, StraightFlame. In the beginning I was opposed to altering anyone's areas, but by the time we got to the end I don't think anyone's work was left untouched. Evil's stuff was probably even more controversial than the future, but it also received more editing. He had waterfalls coming out of trees!

Personally, I'm proud to have my name on this level, Greenfire Road included. I didn't realize that the elevator didn't go up originally and that the Future was robbed of it's purpose. If you, StraightFlame, want to rework the GFR, or if you'd like me to; then I'm willing to revisit this project for that purpose.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: MasterF on January 04, 2013, 21:10:06
This was REALLY good.It was very atmospheric,and the addition of the challenge/enviromental part was cool,even though I found the challenge area rather easy.
I think I might be missing some secrets.I found
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)

I got really confused at the future area,did it do anything or was the NPC that just noticed the statue elevator secretly a real person that made the area and then noticed it was pointless?

P.S:The ending is really adorable.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: StraightFlame on January 04, 2013, 22:35:04
I got really confused at the future area,did it do anything or was the NPC that just noticed the statue elevator secretly a real person that made the area and then noticed it was pointless?

As detailed in my 612-page apology to anyone who reached that area, i made it just for the purpose of adding a way to get back up, and after someone decided to make the elevator go up, i hoped someone would make it have a purpose.

The guy is based on my character in this (http://nifflas.lpchip.nl/index.php?topic=3560.0) game, though his reaction when he discovered the lift can also go up is entirely my reaction (minus the "413 years" bit) to the same thing.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: sergiocornaga on January 05, 2013, 03:08:51
I think I might be missing some secrets.I found
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)

If my memory can be trusted, there are three other hidden characters. One of them is very hard to reach, another is almost impossible.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: egomassive on January 05, 2013, 13:43:33
@MasterF: There a quite a few secrets hidden in the level...
Spoiler: secrets list (click to show/hide)

Edit: Updated figure with GrayFace's tip
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: GrayFace on January 05, 2013, 14:26:45
Never thought of gaining upwards momentum this way, this may be helpful indeed. My tactic is to 'jump off' the right way. First, press the arrow button, then jump. There's a few ticks after Juni stops touching the wall in which she can jump.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: MasterF on January 05, 2013, 15:06:54
I think I had to use this trick in a screen in Rain* to get the enemy detector.It's tough,but usable.
Now,then,I guess I have to play this again!
PS:Found the painter!His crust fought back!
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: egomassive on January 05, 2013, 18:38:56
Thanks for the tip GrayFace. I never figured that out myself. I've added it to the figure. I know I'm getting off topic a bit, but there's a similar move when you have the run, climb, and high-jump powers (see figure 2.) It's of no use in this level though.

By the way, these are more like mistakes designers should avoid lest advanced players break their levels. Using them for secrets is fine, but they should never be necessary in any level lower than lunatic grade, imho.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: StraightFlame on January 05, 2013, 19:12:46
Funny how you use THAT tileset; i've been using it to practise KS level design the last few days.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: LPChip on January 05, 2013, 20:30:53
I've posted this years ago when I was still using windows xp, but its a good showcase for these jumps which we used to call Triangular jumping.

http://files.lpchip.com/temp/flashmovies/KS%20Jump1/Knytt%20Stories%20Jump.html
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: StraightFlame on January 05, 2013, 23:56:55
In exactly what universe do the windows in XP look like that?
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: MasterF on January 06, 2013, 00:04:23
Damn,it just comes to say "DO NOT USE THESE JUMPS IN ANY NORMAL LEVEL"Also that Windows XP was very wierd,lol.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: LPChip on January 06, 2013, 13:44:49
Its a visual style for windows XP. :P Anyway, back to the topic. :)
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: Ultigonio on January 11, 2013, 08:14:28
Holy cow, it's released! I guess I've gotta' play it now, huh...?  Fantastic job to all of you for having the initiative to complete it though, whoa!
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: Hmpf on January 11, 2013, 20:38:41
Oh man! I just started playing this... and it's already making me very, very happy! Such lovely scenery you guys made from this awesome tileset (and such wonderful tilesets you made to go with it!) And the snow storm! Ahhhhhhhhhh....
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: Hmpf on January 12, 2013, 19:47:55
Okay, just did my daily fifteen minutes of KS, and I think I managed to get stuck a bit with this level, lol. What do I have to do for the game to allow me to explore the caves? I kind of assume I'll find the swipe card I need there? And I already found the reactor tech's diary entry that said he relaxed by exploring the caves, so I figured that would be enough of a reason for Juni to go there - but she still refuses.

ETA: The tree in the lab!!!! Loved that bit in particular. (I think it's official: for me, KS fulfills the psychological function of a garden.)
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: Hmpf on January 12, 2013, 22:08:21
Never mind, I'm an idiot. I seem to be very good at overlooking very obvious things at the moment.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: egomassive on January 13, 2013, 13:06:56
Sorry, about that part Hmpf. Directing players on a linear path through a level designed by many people with scarcely more direction other than, "Make it look Wintery," was quite a challenge for us.

When I originally signed on for tileset making, I thought the level would play like Gaia. There would be several loosely connected plot threads, and if you followed one far enough you'd find a ending. Mostly it would just be nice scenery. It turned out that most of the designers were pushing for a single, grand adventure. As we strove toward that end the design challenges rose higher and higher. In the end I'm proud to have my name on this level even though it features running back-and-forth across the map and not knowing where to go when there's only one place to go.
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: bulbapuck on January 15, 2013, 14:16:34
This level is really good and I'm very proud to have been a part of it. It's insane to see how coherent the story is considering that the level is a collaborative project. Headgrinder, Egomassive and Sergio Cornaga, you guys are fantastic for taking over and finishing it up in such great style. a :hiddenstar: to you all :)

When I first started the project I figured it would just be a very small level with little to no story that resembled "great art" but with a wintery theme. I never expected so many to want to take part in it, and it was an absolute joy following how the level developed as everyone put their own little touch to the project.

Spoiler: (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: Hmpf on January 16, 2013, 00:55:07
Right! I've finished this now! Except I think I have to play it again, because I played it in three separate sessions with two much time in between, so when I started again I usually didn't quite know where I'd left off, and I think as a result of this I may have missed some things.

But it was great!

Spoiler: (click to show/hide)

But why do I get credit for the concept? I just said something like "I like this tileset, wouldn't it be great if someone made a level from it?" I think that hardly counts as providing a concept! :D


[mod]fixed spoiler tag[/mod]
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: egomassive on January 16, 2013, 02:50:05
@ Hmpf: Actually you wanted to use Smashy's Tundra tileset for a Round-Robin, set up some ground rules, and convinced Bulbapuck that it was a worthwhile endeavor. Here's the thread. (http://nifflas.lpchip.nl/index.php?topic=2809.0)
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: Hmpf on January 21, 2013, 17:58:38
@ Hmpf: Actually you wanted to use Smashy's Tundra tileset for a Round-Robin, set up some ground rules, and convinced Bulbapuck that it was a worthwhile endeavor. Here's the thread. (http://nifflas.lpchip.nl/index.php?topic=2809.0)

Oh.

:D
Title: Re: Endless Winter [easy/challenge]
Post by: seattalite on September 28, 2015, 06:49:11
I just wanted to say thank you to everyone who worked so hard to put this together - especially the KS vets/masters - ego, sergio, headgrinder, et al. I'm about to play this again from the start. I never got a chance to finish when I played it when you guys firs put this out. awesome level.