Nifflas' Support Forum

Being Creative => Collaborations => Topic started by: Headgrinder on February 11, 2011, 13:52:04

Title: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on February 11, 2011, 13:52:04
Welcome to the Tundra Trek Round Robin!

I'm changing the rules of engagement here because I've gone through four people from the old list and no one was available.  Soo...

This is now a first come first serve Round Robin.  Simply be the first to post that you are editing the last posted edit, give us an idea what your working on, and give us an idea of when you'll be done.  Take your time, but try to keep it down to a few weeks.  Then when your done, post it here on the thread.

In order to keep track of which edit of the bin we have, lets start adding an edit number to the end of the bin name, kind of like a version number.  So, whoever does the first edit, name your bin 'Niffforum - Something with snow e1.knytt.bin,' the next person 'Niffforum - Something with snow e2.knytt.bin,' etc. 
__________________

Plot:
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)

SOOOOoooooo, this is where we are so far.  
______________________________

Endings:

Spoiler: (click to show/hide)
________________________________

Additional issues:

    * Decide on an opening sequence.  I feel we can leave this in the hands of any one person who wants to make the opening cut scene.
    * A scene with Dr. Wood, furthering the plot, and perhaps receiving an object that helps disable the winter.
    * Fix messages like, "I don't have a sound card." and, "I ran out of time."  Also, fix bad spelling and grammar.
    * A place where the underwater section exits (not into the sky)
    * Add lab 1... maybe.
    * Voids/SGEs
    * Redevelop the room(s) at the end of the lab 3 radiation area to be person free and more key to the plot.
    * Flag3 is broken.  Do we want to fix this with something in lab 2 or 3, or just remove the whole flag 2 and 3 issue?
________________________________

Further plot and level suggestions:
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)
_____________________________

Last of all, I was as confused as heck about the flag business and how to get into the ice cave.  I'm pretty sure the reason is that I broke flag3.   :oops:  At any rate, since I took the time to put together a walkthrough, here it is too:

Spoiler: (click to show/hide)
_____________________________


For my own sake, I think I will be extending the deadlines to 2 week intervals rather than 1 week.  

I would also like to discuss some alternative methods for completing portions of the level.  Since I've seen a lot of people who would like to help but don't know how, One way could be to drawing numbers to see who finishes which part of the project.  Another would be to re-ask for contributors who specifically want to see this level finished asap, and put them on a permanent rotation until it IS done.  

I'll contact everyone on the current list and advise them of this.


Here's to finishing a knice level!  
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Firecat on February 11, 2011, 20:30:22
So, i made a map marking the screens/areas that may require improvement.

Orange:The icicle caves, both paths need to be completed, (Or are they already completed?,i don't know if i have SF's update). Also:
   
* Flag3 is broken.  Do we want to fix this with something in lab 2 or 3, or just remove the whole flag 2 and 3 issue?
Cyan:Mountainside village, related to:
* I'd like to see the insides of the village to the right of Juni's cabin and have that area tied into the plot.  I like the idea of these being the descendants of the ancient culture.  Perhaps the reason it doesn't snow in the village is someone there has an object we will need to get the balanced and tropic endings.  Maybe we need to get their trust by doing something like investigating the labs, the cave, or something from Dr. Wood.
Purple:The underwater area, related to:
* The under water section MIGHT be an interesting place for the summer goddesses cave, as in you come up out of water and into the cave.  Or, perhaps more fitting, maybe a flooded lab 1 is down here, though that might need some plot tie in.  Maybe Dr. Wood needs something from there and can't swim!  That would fit with the mechanical background.  Either way, the "no climbs" would need to be removed so you can get back out of the original entrance, or else there needs to be a second exit from the water area.  Would Evil like to be involved in finishing this area???  It is his after all.

sergiocornaga: What if the water section (which doesn't currently have a purpose) were to become the area for locking the Winter God away for the third ending? The surface could be frozen over at first, and only become accessible after re-establishing the power of the Summer Goddess.
Green:Dr.wood machine, maybe accessible with third Keycard. Related to:
* A scene with Dr. Wood, furthering the plot, and perhaps receiving an object that helps disable the winter.

* Some thoughts on the conversation with Dr. Wood:  "I don't believe it!  You've been able to get all the cards so far?  I soooo need your help!"  He's trying to figure out how to end the eternal winter, and asks your help.  There perhaps needs to be 2 visits to him, one for the compromise ending, and one for the tropical ending.  Or perhaps it is the indigenous people who want the tropical ending because it means an end of the whole sources of power thing, something Dr. Wood would probably not want.
Blue:Greenfire Road, related to:
* I feel kind of bad for the way I've handled streightflames and his area.  I think I tried to sweep it under the rug because I couldn't figure out how it could fit.  Then someone said "perhaps it doesn't need to."  Right.  So, any suggestion on this?  If not, I'm done trying to manipulate this area.
Red:The place where you find Dr.woods key card. It activates Flag 2 instead of an unused flag.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: AClockworkLemon on February 12, 2011, 09:17:56
Sorry guys, you'll have to take me off the list :(

I had a great time the first time around, i just cant get enthused about it anymore.
Or KS in general...

 :sad:

I still occasionally play levels, but don't expect to see me around here much anymore.

Oh, btw, When the level is completed (because it will be  :^^:), gimme a yell! make sure to send me an email ASAP, 'cus i might not get it otherwise :)
aclockworklemon1('at')gmail.com
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on February 12, 2011, 15:17:12
Very very sorry to hear that ClockWork.   :sad:

Firecat, thank you so much for the map!  Very handy.  8)

EDIT:  Just updated the list, and took ClockWork off.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: bulbapuck on February 13, 2011, 16:15:20
I'm completely swamped right now, so you can just skip me for the moment :/
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on February 13, 2011, 16:52:55
Ok, Pick Yer Poison is up.  I did some more spoilers on the first post to make it easier on the scroll bars.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: jetio4 on February 24, 2011, 18:39:53
Necro >.<
A. Is Pick Yer Poison working on it?
B. I'll be happy to check spelling and grammer, and fix any errors.
C. For the opening, how about Juni was captured while adventuring by a group of people, undecided on who, and is told to live in the area for, say, a year. This will also explain why she needs Firewood (to live). When she turns it into a summer location, it makes it easier for her to live. This also gives you a chance to make an opening area to give the player a tutorial or something. Or just an opening area for the heck of it.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on March 06, 2011, 22:45:46
Yikes, I've already let this thing slip into the land of dead threads.  I never heard from Pick Yer Poison, and I forgot that he hasn't been very active, so I'll be pming Vinterrun

Uhm... sorry for not responding jetio.  You are more than welcome to contribute.  I'm guessing I should add you to the bottom of the list to be fair, although I suppose that if ANYONE wanted to do cut scenes they could simply post them in the thread and whoever is next on the list could stick them in.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on March 13, 2011, 21:32:33
Well ok then!  I guess I'm up, but since we've gone through almost the entire list with no takers, I'm going to make some changes to the ways we do business.  I've also noticed that... well... I don't know which bin I have is the newest, and I'm not sure off the top of my head where the most recent is available for download.  So, I'll be imposing some different rules that I will include in the first post as soon as I have the figured out.  I think it will involve scrapping the list in favor of a first come first serve format with a rule about posting on this list as soon as your done with a counter in the title distinguishing the newest from the others.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on March 19, 2011, 23:27:04
Ok, here's the deal.  I'm going to post a link to the last modification to the level that I'm aware of.  It was StreightFlames' edit, and this is his link:

http://www.mediafire.com/?bhrh6s264549gt1

Now, the new rule is first come first serve!  I'll edit the first post to reflect that.  What you do is be the first to post that you are working on it, give us an idea of what your doing, and when you expect to be done (no real time limit, but try to keep it to a couple of weeks).  When your done, post your edit here.  Simple enough?  This way, we don't have to constantly be just waiting to take a turn, pming, and stuff. 

I'm out for a little while because I'm doing a lot of over time at work, but if no one takes it up in a week or two, I probably will.

Edit:  Ok, read the first post please to get the full run down.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on March 20, 2011, 06:00:34
Sounds like a good plan. The old list definitely wasn't working anymore. I'm seriously considering taking a turn later on, and with this setup I can probably dive in when inspiration hits.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Firecat on March 21, 2011, 00:11:42
I will work on it a little bit, adding and fixing to the icicle caves. I think it shouldn't take long, so if you don't hear anything from me in two weeks feel free to skip me.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on March 22, 2011, 13:02:01
Hey, cool!  It appears to be a good plan given it is already starting to work!  I've been trying to get that list to work for months!  :P  I think this format will get people more directly involved in paying attention to the thread so they can grab their chance, rather than getting board with waiting for someone to PM them. 
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Firecat on March 26, 2011, 20:54:24
Something with snow e1:
http://www.mediafire.com/?k69sb48knb5076p
Changes:
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on March 27, 2011, 00:49:34
Sounds confusing. Thanks for working it all out for us Firecat. Downloading...
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on March 28, 2011, 15:13:59
I'm having trouble with your download link, Firecat. Does anyone share my issues?
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on March 29, 2011, 01:59:52
^: I got it without trouble. I just checked and the link still works for me.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on March 29, 2011, 03:38:09
It's working for me now, too. Guess it just had some downtime yesterday.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on March 30, 2011, 13:55:06
Thanks for the work Firecat.  I just did some quick testing (all I have time for right now) and the tourist path is looking very nice!  There are a lot of very creative screens in there which makes me almost wish the area was larger! 

However, if the player has all the power ups, x1013y1000 has a wall swim problem if you go through the left side, and x1015y1000 has a wall swim issue if you climb up.  Hmm... maybe the player can't get all power ups prior to that area... 

And I don't know what I did wrong, but I couldn't find the "random guy at the end of Mountainside Village."  Does he appear only when you do some of the lab work?

And we may want to tweak the minor edits to the explorer path just because it is visually jarring.

Thank ya thank ya.  Anyone next?
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Firecat on March 30, 2011, 14:56:04
However, if the player has all the power ups, x1013y1000 has a wall swim problem if you go through the left side, and x1015y1000 has a wall swim issue if you climb up.  Hmm... maybe the player can't get all power ups prior to that area...
I designed that place to only work with Run  and Climb powerups. as they are the only ones received at the start, and the only other powerups in the game get lost when you leave the area they are used for.
And I don't know what I did wrong, but I couldn't find the "random guy at the end of Mountainside Village."  Does he appear only when you do some of the lab work?
Yes, you must first go to the room with the keyholes (The original trigger) in order to the guy to appear. I think it isn't the best solution to fix the flag problem, as it would cause confusion. Do you have any ideas on how to tell Juni that the keys are in the cave while still keeping Lab 3 abandoned?  I was thinking in adding a computer with a log telling a co-worker where to find the keys in case they have to open the reactor, but i didn't want to modify the lab.
And we may want to tweak the minor edits to the explorer path just because it is visually jarring.
Do you said it because of the pyramid?.Yeah, Its hard to make a completely diagonal landscape that doesn't wall-swim, So i just added some holes.

I'm looking forward for this level to be complete. :)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on April 01, 2011, 00:09:55
I like the computer idea a lot, but I'm just curious why the guy couldn't just always be there and say something like, "I saw some keys in the caves.  Wonder how they got there?"  Shoot, I never understood why the caves have to be blocked by the character's fear anyway. 

Ahh, but that doesn't matter.  As long as the guy appears, we are good to go and I really must stop being picky so we can get this level done.  :)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on April 01, 2011, 01:50:20
I haven't played the latest version yet, but is there anything that points you towards the ice cave after seeing the keyholes? If a player went there before and saw nothing, they may not return when they need to.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on April 02, 2011, 03:08:05
I think that is the role of the guy in the village, though I"m concerned the player may not know to get to him.  Soooo.. perhaps the computer idea is the best.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: jetio4 on April 11, 2011, 18:58:48
(9 Days Later)So... anyone working on it?
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on April 14, 2011, 13:33:29
No one has said they are working on it.  I'm getting closer and closer to releasing my current project as a beta test to a few willing players, so it is hard for me to pull away from that to work on this.  So the answer is no, not at the moment.

Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: PeppyHare4000 on June 11, 2011, 05:28:05
well... this topic seems to be dead...
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on June 15, 2011, 10:46:04
The enthusiasm this level once enjoyed is gone, but I don't think it's dead. I plan to take a turn at some point, but like Headgrinder, I have a different KS project that needs to be completed first.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on June 18, 2011, 02:49:37
I suppose I can't be blamed for all the loss of enthusiasm, though I have semi dropped the ball to work on my main project.  But now that it is in beta testing, I may start to get this thing rolling again.  Just sayin.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on May 20, 2012, 05:45:22
Ouch! Nearly a year of inactivity here. Well, I finished the project I was working on that kept me from helping here, and although I'm busy making other things now, I'm going to take a look at this and try to lay out a road map to completing this project. Wish me luck!

I remember that one of the things Tundra Trek lacked entirely was cutscenes. They are not my strong suit, but they'll probably be the majority of my contribution. I will have to make at least one area. As for the length of my turn, I expect I'll just hang onto it until either I finish it, or someone asks for a turn.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on May 20, 2012, 06:30:47
I appreciate this hugely! I wanted this to be revived, but was too confused by the proposed plot to do it myself. I think you're the best person to do this so I'm glad you decided you could take time away from your other projects. I'd be happy to take a turn after more of the necessary narrative content is in place.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on May 20, 2012, 07:43:34
Sounds great. I've just replayed through the whole thing. It looks like there's very little it needs in terms of level design or bug fixes. I must say, I hadn't played for several updates, and I was pleasantly surprised at how close to completion it is. Mostly it needs the story filled in and directions for the player to prevent needless running back and forth.

Spoiler: (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on May 20, 2012, 16:21:17
Yaay!  Yeah,  there are some difficult areas and ideas to bring together in this level, and I've wanted to try to fix it for a while.  Unfortunately, my thoughts have been too close to, "well, if I change this area..."

Edit: didn't see ego's post before writing this...
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on May 21, 2012, 00:21:17
I've read over the old discussions. I'm sticking with the ideas we set forth. I will alter a few things to improve the course of the game and story.
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on May 21, 2012, 04:29:50
I really like your plan.  I'm confused about the umbrella as well.  There is a hidden journal that is reachable only with the umbrella, which I made, and I guess I just assumed someone else would get the umbrella in.

And the guy that was in lab 3... I left his dialogue in the world.ini file if I remember right.  I'll look it up in the morning if I get a chance.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on May 24, 2012, 05:55:40
Progress Report: I've patched up the level so it will work with my vision. I'm making the smallest edits I can. I've laid out a plan for manufacturing the huge number of cutscene images we'll need. I'm attaching a part of a scene for you to see the art direction I'm going with and voice your opinions. The background is a four times scale of a map screen, it's intentionally blurry to make the characters pop out. The characters are being drawn with vectors, so that once I draw an asset I can mix and match it with any other assets to create new poses, characters, and expressions.

Edit: Oh hey. I just made a sharp version of the same image. Not sure which is better.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: LPChip on May 24, 2012, 09:45:10
The sharp one is definitely better. The left one hurts my eyes.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on May 24, 2012, 13:50:59
Hmm. I didn't consider eye strain. I know I hate blurry fonts, because I try to focus on something that can't be focused. Yeah, I'll go with the crisp image. I wanted to go all blurry because some bits start out blurry, like the chair legs. I thought the results would be more uniform that way, but being consistently bad isn't really a plus.

I've realized that I don't need to have the current version of the level to make the cutscenes. I'm going to finish up all the level design I want to do myself, then post it for someone else to take a turn. While they're building onto the map I can make the cutscenes. There are 3 areas to be built upon; a tourist reactor path, an expanded failed experiment storage, and a Lab 1 final area.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: GrayFace on May 25, 2012, 04:42:17
That's an interesting style. The character's border lines are too thin.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on May 25, 2012, 05:29:08
That's an interesting style. The character's border lines are too thin.

Alternatively, maybe she should be upscaled in her entirety slightly. Currently Juni looks about the size of her in-game counterpart (which is good for the height of the entrance), but her new look makes her seem a little too small for the furniture.

Oh, since I didn't mention it, I also prefer the sharper one. I briefly considered offering to paint over the backgrounds to remove pixelation, but considering the volume of cutscenes (and the fact that the pixelation doesn't actually look that bad) makes it hard to justify.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on May 25, 2012, 12:50:05
The fact that the character is not pixelated keeps here separated from the background without need of blurring.  It's looking very good!  Trust ego to get this level backin order.  :D
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: GrayFace on May 25, 2012, 17:28:57
Alternatively, maybe she should be upscaled in her entirety slightly. Currently Juni looks about the size of her in-game counterpart (which is good for the height of the entrance), but her new look makes her seem a little too small for the furniture.
Juni? This can't Juni, this is a housewife. I agree she's too small. She should be like 1.4 or 1.3 times bigger. Oh, and the sharp version is surely better.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Raicuparta on May 25, 2012, 17:37:13
It's obviously Juni.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on May 25, 2012, 18:29:29
Junis come in many shapes and sizes. (http://www.auntiepixelante.com/?p=560)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Raicuparta on May 25, 2012, 19:22:19
For some reason I feel kinda weird when people make Juni too sexy :P
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on May 26, 2012, 01:06:08
... a little too small for the furniture. ...
... this is a housewife. ...
Ha ha. I agree she's a little thick for a girl as nimble as she is. I drew her off the original. You can see below how close she comes to her 1/4 size counterpart. I've never been happy with Knytt folk compared to chairs. Their legs are too short for chairs with human proportions, but if I make chairs to fit Knytt proportions the chairs look weird. I should add some length to her legs. This will look better with the furnishings, make her more pose-able, and raise the sexy factor for Raicuparta.  :P
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: GrayFace on May 26, 2012, 02:04:30
Here's a mock-up to make her into Juni. Dress bottom changed, legs moved forward, feet made bigger, boobs made smaller.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on May 26, 2012, 03:48:59
Cool.  You sure get into the details my friend.  I bet you hate it when people say things like, "lets just do a half ass-ed, quick job on this."

As for me, I find it kinda strange to see too much expression on Juni's face.  Her blank stair is like a mask over an everyman/woman.  

Not that I'm saying you should change anything, just throwing out 2 cents.

Edit:  Didn't see grayfaces until now.  Even though Juni is suppose to be a tiny knytt, your Juni looks really good grayface.  The legs seem too long for a knytt, yet somehow they look better too.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: GrayFace on May 26, 2012, 19:20:11
Edit:  Didn't see grayfaces until now.  Even though Juni is suppose to be a tiny knytt, your Juni looks really good grayface.  The legs seem too long for a knytt, yet somehow they look better too.
Indeed, they are a bit too long. Guess the bottom of the dress should be lowered, but it should be done carefully. It should look like she has short legs, but not like her legs are covered with a long dress.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on May 27, 2012, 14:06:15
The level changes I'm making are almost complete. You can play the game from beginning to end now. Aside from cabin interiors, my biggest level contribution is in tweaking the logic. There were so many tiny things like doors with the wrong sounds, sign bubbles with poor placement, shifts that shouldn't be quantized, etc. I made some mistakes myself. I completely forgot about the bug where music doesn't play after cutscenes, so I had to work around that. One cool feature is the the custom objects I've added work in normal KS, but have advanced behaviors when played with my KS mod. 8)

I'll probably have it posted later today, so someone can work on the final areas. Then, I'll work on cutscenes separately. Speaking of which, GrayFace, I like your rework of my Juni. I had tried to draw her in a coat and past-the-knees skirt because of the weather, but I didn't make her big enough for those details to come through.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on May 27, 2012, 15:24:11
Sounds like you've put a lot of work into the level. I look forward to seeing the changes.

I've come up with some ideas for the reactor tourist path, so once you've posted the level I'd love to get to work on that. I'll be impressed if we can make this level have a path to the end that is entirely environmental if the player so desires.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on May 27, 2012, 21:38:13
OK. I've got to hand this off, or I'll never move on to cutscene creation.

Download Endless Winter version e2 25.5 MB
Edit: Newer versions are available

I changed the name, by the way. I have no idea what the version number means --the last one was e1. PM me for the script if you want to see it and you're planning to take a turn.

Spoiler: Todo list (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Healy on May 28, 2012, 08:35:58
I just played through this. Overall I enjoyed it, but I do admit that I was pretty discombobulated during all running back and forth between the labs. Hopefully the cutscenes will reduce that feeling in the final game.

Also, I was thinking about working on Lab 1, but I'm not sure what's expected to be in it. I know we need the report somewhere in there, but should there be more backstory, or perhaps a challenge course (with an option to opt out, as is usual)? I guess I could read through the old thread.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on May 28, 2012, 12:37:46
I've downloaded the level and fixed a bunch of typos, not yet reached the end or started work on the tourist path, though.

Healy, I'll leave Lab 1 alone in case you decide to try your hand at it.

egomassive, if you have one handy, an updated list of flags and their uses would be a helpful addition to this thread. Otherwise, I might attempt to make one.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on May 28, 2012, 13:42:05
Yeah I had to make my own Flag purpose list to keep track of them. Should have realized you guys would need it too.
Spoiler: Flags (click to show/hide)

@ Healy: To give lost players direction, I added clues throughout the labs. They're not blatant, but they're there. There really isn't much we can do to prevent a lot of running around. I considered setting Lab 4's lobby to level 2 clearance, but Lab 4 was the only place I could find to add a clue for where to get the level 2 card. As for the story, I think I've got that covered. Besides the notes on various computers telling the science side of events, Dr. Wood will explain the accident according to his understanding. Another big chunk, will be in the "History" cutscene which gives the local religious view.

more @ Healy: I'll send you the scripts for the cutscenes. From there you can add on whatever you want. Thanks to Evil's mysterious lake, I made Lab 1 submerged which makes putting information on computers difficult. If you want to turn most of it dry that's up to you. I believe Headgrinder and I decided at some point that Lab 1 was built around an existing shrine to the negative energy pole, AKA: death god; but it's not as if we have the final say on everything.

By the way, the umbrella has been hidden in the level. Cutscene making is going great.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on May 28, 2012, 15:04:51
I'm without Internet on my laptop right now, but I'll DL it as soon as possible. 

Wow, pretty exciting this is getting wrapped up,
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Firecat on May 30, 2012, 00:44:10
Wow, pretty nice update. Although i saw you credited me for the icicle tileset when i actually don't recall doing it myself (I think it was Ultigonio)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on May 30, 2012, 02:23:27
:oops: It's hard to remember who did what at this point. I'll fix it when I get my next turn. Glad you liked it.
Edit: 30May2012: Finished the first cutscene. You can grab it now if you want, or you can probably get it in the next level update. I'm awfully happy with it. :)

Download EndlessWinterIntro.zip (http://egomassive.com/temp/EndlessWinterIntro.zip) 250 KB

And, here's an icon I made for the level (see attachment.)

Edit: 2Jun2012: I've finished 2 cutscenes and started a 3rd. There will be 6 story cutscenes as well as 2 informational scenes (like the books in Gaia or A Day at the Beach.) I've decided to make a hidden cutscene as well. This brings the total to 9! Yikes! But, there are less than 7 left.

Edit: 6Jun2012: I've finished 3 cutscenes now. I'm going to wait to release anymore until I've finished them all.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on June 08, 2012, 19:52:25
Cutscene making is still going well, 5 finished, 4 to go. Before I could make 3 of the remaining scenes I had to make the Doctor's CO. Then, I had to make a new chalkboard so you could see him better. I can put them in on my next turn, but I wanted to post them now to make sure they don't interfere with anyone else's changes.
Code: [Select]
[Custom Object 18]
;These instructions work in KS 1.2.1 and KS 1.2.ego
Image=Wood.png
Bank=3
Object=21
Offset X=12
Init AnimTo=39
Init AnimLoopBack=10
Init AnimSpeed=150
The scientist is inspired by the work of LPchip and Raicuparta. The chalk board is inspired by the work of LPchip.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on June 09, 2012, 02:45:53
Looking good! Were you still planning to make a robot CO to replace the guy in the reactor? I ask because I'm making a bunch of modifications to those rooms for the tourist path and I'm wondering if I should throw a few 'beeps' into his existing dialogue while I'm at it.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on June 09, 2012, 10:42:06
In lab 4 I gave a hint to the location of the level 2 key card. In the hint I mentioned the reactor guy was an android and called it good enough. I could make a new sprite, but I'm torn on these modifications. I want to make a cohesive level, but I want to respect everyone's efforts too. Sergio, the reactor is your area too now. What do you want?
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on June 09, 2012, 17:08:15
I know what you mean about respecting people's efforts, but I don't think I've been doing it to the same degree. Apparently my feelings have changed since 2010 (http://nifflas.lpchip.nl/index.php?topic=3498.msg48613#msg48613), probably because I really liked seeing the expansion of my environmental path into something much larger. I've been adding extra details to existing rooms that extend their ideas, but hopefully retain their original spirit. I hadn't really considered that these actions could be received negatively. Oh well, if anybody's unhappy with my changes you have my blessing to undo them.

If I had access to the animations for that green guy, I'd probably make a palette swap of him with a grey metallic body and red eyes. As I mentioned, I like the idea of modifying his dialogue slightly in reference to dotdot's talking computers from Rainy Day Adventure:

EDIT: I've noticed that several doors are marked with '(press down to enter)' signs, especially in the village, but the vast majority aren't. This is a tough decision, so I'd like to hear some opinions: do you think these signs should be removed for consistency? Or maybe something else should be done?
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on June 11, 2012, 20:38:11
I've noticed that several doors are marked with '(press down to enter)' signs, especially in the village, but the vast majority aren't. This is a tough decision, so I'd like to hear some opinions: do you think these signs should be removed for consistency? Or maybe something else should be done?
That was something I questioned myself. I did a lot to try and make everything similar, but everybody had a different method. In some places putting, "push down to enter," is impossible because all the signs are used. In one place it notifies you when the doors are locked. I think the instructions on card swipes that indicate weather or not they will work are important to preventing frustration, and the decontamination area should be altered to have the same behavior. Also, the messages that describe what you've picked up are important, and should be applied to the relic.

Personally, I'd prefer to see the doors marked because "push down to enter" although very common is not standard. But when combined with card swipes, the information becomes redundant. Maybe the message could be placed on the Elder's house, since it is key that the player enter it, but afterwards not have it appear there or anywhere else in the game.

The dialogue changes you've suggested sound good to me. The fact that a person was placed there altered the direction the game was headed, so I think this change would respectfully bring it back on course. If anyone oversteps their bounds I'm going to blame Hmpf for everything, because it was her idea to do a round robin and she wasn't here to moderate us. :P But seriously, I think everyone involved would be most happy just to see this project concluded.

Edit: I just looked. I didn't export the sprites for object 3:27 myself, but I believe you can find sprites for everything in KS DS.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Raicuparta on June 11, 2012, 21:46:01
Just a suggestion, maybe you guys can look into this, see if it is a possible solution.
In my "Time Fixes Everything" level, I place a blue "Detect Target" object in front of any object that can be used by pressing down. It might not be completely obvious at first, but if you start with stuff that yell "PRESS DOWN HERE", the player will get used to it and start associating the blue glow with a usable object. The problem is that the glow might not be very visible in some backgrounds (white ones in particular, if I remember correctly), so it would be a good idea to have darker doors.
Don't know exactly what your situation is, but this could be a way for you to do it.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on June 14, 2012, 19:58:18
I think the instructions on card swipes that indicate weather or not they will work are important to preventing frustration, and the decontamination area should be altered to have the same behavior.

Do you mean "Swipe card... (nothing happens)"? To me those messages felt erroneous, an indication of the result of using the wrong card rather than having no card. I preferred the cases where there was no supplementary message. Do you think something like "Swipe card... (you don't have a card)" would address this issue, or were you referring to something else?

Maybe the message could be placed on the Elder's house, since it is key that the player enter it, but afterwards not have it appear there or anywhere else in the game.

This is a good idea. But I think "(Press down to open doors)" signs should also be placed outside Mrs. Soup's house and the other houses in the village, since they will probably be encountered prior to the Elder's house. The climbing power should be suitable as a flag to remove the signs.

I just looked. I didn't export the sprites for object 3:27 myself, but I believe you can find sprites for everything in KS DS.

Thanks! Using 3:27 as a base, I've implemented an explicitly robotic custom object.

In my "Time Fixes Everything" level, I place a blue "Detect Target" object in front of any object that can be used by pressing down.

This is also a good idea, but I think it would be too troublesome to implement in this level now... we've been using the detector as a flag-based substitute for scuba gear.

I've been working on this for over 2 weeks! Sorry, everyone. I should be done and ready to let someone else have a turn soon.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on June 15, 2012, 01:43:51
I agree that "nothing happens" isn't perfect, but it's short and to the point. "you don't have a card" is only applicable when you don't have any cards, and "you don't have the right card" is slightly wrong when you have no cards. I'm not against a change there though.

Your plan for cabin door messages at the beginning sounds good to me.

The detector can easily be swapped out for a flag if we want to use it to indicate places of interaction. Just search the ini for "Power5" and replace with "7" assuming you haven't used flag 7 already. I'll need to know if this is what we're doing before I make the cutscene where she get's the power to go underwater.

I've been working on this for over 2 weeks! Sorry, everyone. I should be done and ready to let someone else have a turn soon.
I'm just glad other people came back on board. I don't mind if you take your time --gives me an excuse to procrastinate on the last 4 cutscenes. :)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Raicuparta on June 15, 2012, 11:10:31
I agree that "nothing happens" isn't perfect, but it's short and to the point. "you don't have a card" is only applicable when you don't have any cards, and "you don't have the right card" is slightly wrong when you have no cards. I'm not against a change there though.
If you need something that works for both cases, why not just "you need a green card" or something like that?
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on June 15, 2012, 16:54:49
"you don't have a card" is only applicable when you don't have any cards, and "you don't have the right card" is slightly wrong when you have no cards.

I think that at the moment, when you have the wrong card it lets you swipe it but sends back "access denied", so unless that also needs changing , "you don't have a card" shouldn't be a problem.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on June 17, 2012, 15:49:28
IMHO you should take all the time you need, unless perhaps someone is explicitly waiting for a turn.  And I too am just so happy to see this level on its way to completion!  Every time I get an e-mail saying someone has posted here, I grin quite largely.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on June 17, 2012, 19:54:47
OK then! I'll work on the level until progress slows to a crawl or someone else posts about wanting a turn... whichever comes first.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on June 28, 2012, 02:28:54
I finished another cutscene today. That makes 6 completed scenes out of 9. This last one was a doosy with 9 frames, but the final 2 main story scenes will be even bigger with 12 and 18 frames. :( On the bright side, I shouldn't need to make too many new sprites for the remaining scenes.

I'm excited to show these scenes off, but I think it's better if I keep them under wraps until we release the final version. Then, people who have already played the level several times will get the most enjoyment from the final product.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on June 28, 2012, 23:43:58
star!
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: PeppyHare4000 on July 04, 2012, 21:24:31
I give you props for taking all this effort to finish what a lot of people Started!

*Gives star*
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on July 07, 2012, 22:51:21
I've been putting off bringing up an important topic, but I think this level's using copyrighted (non-public) music. I'm pretty sure Music 22 and Ambiance 23 are remixes of the Zora's Domain theme from the Legend of Zelda games. If I'm right then we should look for replacement options. I like the mix and usually take the Icicle Cave challenge route so I can hear it, and the intro-to-loop transition is well done. It will be hard to replace, but I don't want my name attached to a product using stolen music.

Edit: Progress Report: I just finished the biggest cutscene of the level. I trimmed it from 18 frames to 15 mainly because I felt some of the comedy planned at the end of it didn't work. This leaves the closing scene and the bonus scene to do. :)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on July 08, 2012, 05:38:39
If you mean this song (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIqailPd89I), I can't hear the resemblance. I thought those might be original tracks by Ultigonio(?) but I could be mistaken.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on July 09, 2012, 22:46:23
Ah, when I listen to them side by side the similarities fall apart. I read through Ultigonio's comments on the old thread. He made the area, and though I didn't see him comment on the music he probably authored it being a musician. I guess I've heard it so many times now that it feels like an old classic to me. Sorry, for the false alarm.

Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on August 01, 2012, 23:17:05
I worked on this for a while today. I figured I should finish making the cutscenes before I forgot the methods I was using. The ending scene is now three screens from completion complete. Then, I'll have the bonus scene and they'll all be done.

OK then! I'll work on the level until progress slows to a crawl or someone else posts about wanting a turn... whichever comes first.
How are things on your end Sergio?
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on August 03, 2012, 01:08:23
I think it's reached crawl-status. I'll finish up the areas I'm working on and put the level up here within a week.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on August 03, 2012, 17:46:02
I've finished the bonus cutscene which means I've completed all the cutscenes. I am quite pleased with how easily these scenes came together and how good they they look. I may stick with this method from now on. Like I said before, I'm going to keep the scenes under wraps until the level is finished, but here's one preview because I'm proud and weak.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Widget on August 03, 2012, 17:57:45
That's a really appealing style. I know mixing resolutions is supposed to be a no-go but I like the way it's turned out here. If it really is a lot easier to produce aswell then that's fantastic.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on August 03, 2012, 23:20:24
It's an interesting technique.  It does seem strange to use the normal low rez characters for a cut scene, so I definitely see the production appeal. 
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on August 04, 2012, 13:34:04
The resolution of the background is low because it's simply an enlarged screenshot which is a huge time-saver, but the best part is the character sprites are reusable. Every pose and expression can be interchanged, plus they're made with vectors so if I need to move an arm I only have to draw a new arm. (There are a few unique poses to keep the characters from feeling static.) Many of the scenes just had to be assembled and that was the biggest boost to production.

Mixing resolutions caused some interesting issues, like what to do when hi-rez characters interact with low-rez stuff. These parts didn't fare so well. There's also the fun fact of Juni's power-ups being just as big as she is. At this scale it becomes comical. I guess the more I analyze it the less appealing it looks for future projects, but the economy of effort versus quality is too good to ignore.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on August 04, 2012, 19:59:47
The characters themselves are obviously a huge plus though.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Widget on August 04, 2012, 20:22:54
Have you considered using this style for the majority of cutscenes and one of the more time-consuming styles for certain key points of the story? I could see this working really well combined with the style you used in The Dying Core.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on August 08, 2012, 03:12:25
I'm sorry to say that I've caught a nasty cold, so putting the level up will have to wait until I'm well enough to use my computer.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on August 24, 2012, 13:10:58
Get well soon man, and not just for the upload.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on August 24, 2012, 16:57:39
Get well soon man, and not just for the upload.

Thankfully I'm well now (it would be a worry if I wasn't by now!) and have resumed work on the level. I've implemented most of the fixes I talked about earlier in the thread along with some other secret surprises. My plan is to put it up soon in a state that can be considered complete (though with all revisions open to discussion and further changes, of course), save for egomassive's cutscenes and the concluding area which I'm leaving for someone else. Maybe Healy if she's still interested!
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on August 26, 2012, 09:11:47
Wow, "considered complete!"  Now I'm really looking forward to this.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on September 10, 2012, 21:46:21
3.5 months was way too long a turn. But it's over now!

Download Endless Winter version e3 (https://dl.dropbox.com/u/4353469/Nifforum-EndlessWinter-e3.knytt.bin) (28.5 MB)

Spoiler: Updated todo list: (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on September 11, 2012, 06:07:13
Really great additions and alterations! You fixed so many issues that I couldn't figure out how to fix. The icicle cave challenge in particular was much more fun to play. *gives star*

Spoiler: I did find one mistake (click to show/hide)

I think I'll get started on compiling the credits. This ought to be fun.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on September 11, 2012, 07:20:24
Thanks, I'm glad it went down well. As for the error... d'oh, I know exactly what I forgot to do. Serves me right for only testing it in the opposite order. It shouldn't be too hard for anyone to fix, but if needed I can revise it myself.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on September 11, 2012, 12:47:11
*Downloading*

I've been working crazy amounts of overtime, so it may be a while before I can play this, but I'm really excited to see it coming to an end!  Star for now, for all the work you've done, and probably a star for the awesomeness I find when I play it.  :D
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Polana on September 12, 2012, 11:41:30
Hi,
I don't know if it is a bug or if I forgot about something, but I can't get to the cave with keys. I obtained first card, traveled in time and  visited everyone in village and read the diary. Am I missing something ?

By the way, this level is awesome. I can't wait to see it finished. There are only two minor objections to this level:
some cutscenes
time traveling part - you won't get anything there and it doesn't fit with the rest of the level (yes, I know I am the last person, who should complain about such thing).
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on September 12, 2012, 12:23:19
@Polana:

The level is set up so that you actually have to see the locked doors to the reactor before you can get the keys (even though it's otherwise a dead end).

The final version will feature very nice cutscenes by egomassive that you can see previews of earlier in the thead.

As for Linear Greenfire Road, I agree that it's incongruous. But I personally can't think of a way of altering it that stays true to StraightFlame's vision.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on September 12, 2012, 12:52:38
I've compiled the credits. I've left no stone unturned, but if I've missed something please let me know before I turn this list into a scene.
Spoiler: credits (click to show/hide)

I've also gone ahead and added credits to tilesets, large custom objects, and audio tracks. I've repaired the ends of the two very long songs by Sion and adjusted the volume and quality of all tracks. While sifting for credits, I found a midi song demo Wako-kun made for us a long time ago. I've converted it into a tiny music piece which could be perfect for various hidden rooms.

@ Sergio: Did you make the ice cracking sound, Song30? I need the credits for it.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on September 12, 2012, 13:12:24
@ Sergio: Did you make the ice cracking sound, Song30? I need the credits for it.

I could have sworn I hid credits in the comment for that file... maybe I couldn't be bothered because the source file (http://www.freesound.org/people/j1987/sounds/106127/) was public domain. You could credit j1987, and me for the slight modifications I made to it.

No stone unturned, you say... didn't Pick Yer Poison create Song21? Is there music by Kevin MacLeod in the version of the level I uploaded? Did you confirm that Ultigonio wrote music?

By the way, I have a slight preference for 'Sergio Cornaga' over 'Sergiocornaga'.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on September 12, 2012, 17:20:57
After building the village, Pick Yer Poison had this to say...
Sure, I'll post it here then. :D

http://filesmelt.com/dl/Nifforum_-_Tundra_Trek.knytt_.bin (http://filesmelt.com/dl/Nifforum_-_Tundra_Trek.knytt_.bin)

Renamed to Tundra Trek and ready for action. The custom music is by Kevin Macleod.

Ultigonio did in fact start the icicle caves section. He doesn't mention who made the music. I've shot him a PM about it.

I made an Info screen. Opinions welcome. Image Updated
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on September 13, 2012, 00:04:47
Nice.  It would be cool to have a radio tower in the background as reference to the labs... but then again there is no tower in the game.

I guess I will say that the head angle being turned towards the viewer looks a little awkward, though I think it may be something about the line of the spine and neck not being quite natural.  The head might need to sit back a bit further to look right.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on September 13, 2012, 07:16:36
I adjusted Juni's head a bit, (see above.) I put this version of her in the cutscene I swiped it from too.

Ultigonio has responded. He did author those tracks. He gave me their proper names, so I can add them to the meta data.

I didn't realize this before that there were several different page turn sounds. I thought it was one sound copied several times. It's possible that some of them have meta data, just not the one I examined. Nevermind, it's the crack sound that's missing data, not the page sound. Too many facts consumed lately.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Polana on September 13, 2012, 09:21:00
@ Sergio
Thank you.
I did not notice cutscenes first time. They look awesome (info too).
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on September 13, 2012, 12:00:01
Nice.  It would be cool to have a radio tower in the background as reference to the labs... but then again there is no tower in the game.

Maybe something like this?

Edit: Alternate version added.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on September 13, 2012, 12:59:57
Oh!  The hatch!  Yeah, I like it!  2nd one is better, on the snowy field. 

@egomassive: yeah, that looks better.  There isn't a dislocated neck feeling anymore.  *thumbsup*
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on September 13, 2012, 15:33:09
I was going for a lost-in-the-storm look. The bunker entrance adds intrigue, and I find that much more compelling. If I'd never played this level before I would have to know what's behind that door. I'm most impressed at how Sergio inserted it behind the snow storm!

*Ahem* I've been doing some level editing, while we wait for Healy to possibly finish lab 1. The warp error near the reactor is fixed. I've stuck in my version of the top clearance lab. A few things here and there were tweaked for consistency. All the music has been repaired, volume adjusted, and/or quality adjusted. I added some covers for the edges of the storm near the statue switch. There's some new ambiance surrounding the village to smooth the transitions to the storm. The info screen is in there, as well as an improved icon.

My most controversial move was to put music with the various secrets. I'd like you to try it this way, then tell me if you totally hate it. :P

Download Endless Winter e4 17.6 MB
Edit: newer version available
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on September 13, 2012, 18:29:16
I totally approve of the secret area music. The snow slope cover objects really raise the bar! You may have noticed I edited the falling snow object to leave less grey noise on the snow, which I'd basically considered 'good enough' with regards to that problem, but the area definitely looks better now.

Spoiler: Some issues: (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Raicuparta on September 13, 2012, 18:43:23
Playing this level has made me aware of a bug in the KS engine... it seems like it can't handle so many custom objects! Twice now, I've encountered a bug where playing from the start of the game up to going to the underwater area with the umbrella in a single session makes all custom objects stop working. I'm going to try replacing Watersquares2-4 with a single huge custom object to see if that resolves (or affects) it.
How many COs does this have? I have more than 150 on a level (although only around 115 files) and I've never seen this happen before.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on September 13, 2012, 18:49:02
Playing this level has made me aware of a bug in the KS engine... it seems like it can't handle so many custom objects! Twice now, I've encountered a bug where playing from the start of the game up to going to the underwater area with the umbrella in a single session makes all custom objects stop working. I'm going to try replacing Watersquares2-4 with a single huge custom object to see if that resolves (or affects) it.
How many COs does this have? I have more than 150 on a level (although only around 115 files) and I've never seen this happen before.
Yeah, plural's Orientation had about 150 and I never encountered this problem despite playing through it again and again. This one only has about 40, but there are often a lot on screen at once. Which makes me think it's something to do with the way this level handles custom objects. Hence, experimentation!
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on September 13, 2012, 19:23:19
I'm glad you liked the secret area music. I thought the snow looked less jarring on the white ground.

Spoiler: response to issues (click to show/hide)

I lost all CO's on this level once. I could never reproduce it. I've worried about the number of snow objects, but I rarely see performance issues even when big applications are running in the background. The custom object buffers every image at the start of the game, so I don't know why it would overload mid-game. Are you playing with KS1.2.1? I usually use KS+.

Edit: I just played through with KS1.2.1, and it happened when expected. Then, I switched full screen on and off a few times and saw some really crazy stuff, objects appearing in the wrong spot, the game area showing in the upper left corner. Very weird.

I'm not succeeding at removing the pop at 5'34" in Stars at Night. I've managed to turn it into a thut, but I can't eradicate it. So, if someone else want's to try their hand at it, be my guest.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Ultigonio on September 14, 2012, 10:40:30
I'm not succeeding at removing the pop at 5'34" in Stars at Night. I've managed to turn it into a thut, but I can't eradicate it. So, if someone else want's to try their hand at it, be my guest.
Who originally made it?  Small bits of distortion like that usually result from a slight screw-up in the mixing process of the song itself before it's mixed down into whatever file someone is using.  Whoever originally made it, if you can reach them, ask them to see if they can tone down the volume just slightly at that part so it doesn't cause any distortion.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: GrayFace on September 14, 2012, 11:26:55
Here's my take: https://dl.dropbox.com/u/44735333/ks/Song254_fixed.ogg
And in wav: https://dl.dropbox.com/u/44735333/ks/Song254_fixed.wav
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on September 14, 2012, 12:14:37
I still hear pops in GrayFace's ogg version near 5'34". Didn't try the wav. I think getting a hold of the author would be best. I'll try him through his website later.

I replaced the scores of snow COs with a 48 by 240 version. It cut the count down from 130 per screen to 13. It seems to have avoided the issue we're having. This leads me to believe there's a limit to the total number of CO's that can be created during a single session with KS1.2.1.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on September 14, 2012, 13:09:46
That might not be necessary, I think I've pretty much fixed it. This version is in stereo but I crunched the filesize smaller than egomassive's version. If this is deemed acceptable, I can do the same for the other track too.

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/4353469/Song254_fixedfixed.ogg

Edit: And here's a replacement water cover CO, which should reduce the load (and also fixes the issue of the umbrella showing through the wall).

Code: [Select]
;Place on same tile as fish. Previous objects 20, 22 and 23 now obsolete.

[Custom Object 20]
Image=Watercover2.png
Tile Width=256
Tile Height=240
Offset X=84
Offset Y=-60
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on September 14, 2012, 16:33:15
Sergio, I'll let you put those files into the game since I already prepared a new version. :P

Download Endless Winter e5b (http://egomassive.com/temp/Nifforum-EndlessWinter-e5b.knytt.bin) 25MB

This version includes volume adjusted stereo sound, Sergio's version of the info screen, and a snow object that keeps the level from breaking with KS1.2.1. Credits in images have been altered to meet Sergio's concerns. Song254 is the version that's been in there all along minus the pop at the end. Song255 is also the version we've had minus the abrupt end. It turns out that Sion, the author, released that track under 2 names in the same album and both versions end mid-note. I think this version of song255 is fine, but I'm all for Sergio reducing the file sizes.

Edit: [sarcastic]Ah ha ha ha.[/sarcastic] After mentioning that squeezing CO credits in a space smaller than a frame helps prevent user errors, and then changing the credits on a CO to a size larger than a frame, I didn't test it. Level re-uploaded.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on September 15, 2012, 15:50:55
Wow,  this is looking FANTASTIC!  I haven't played through since most of the new changes have been made.  This post has been a stream of reactions which I am now trying to clean up.

Reactions:
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)

So this next bit of spoilers is just all the random crud I was writing before I had a complete picture of all the new edits.  Read only if your very board.  Old edits:
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)

Some one else is already next on taking a turn editing right?  If not, I might try to take a turn with some of the improvements I mentioned.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on September 15, 2012, 23:07:48
Spoiler: @ Headgrinder (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on September 17, 2012, 15:39:30
Headgrinder, I decided to try and fix some of the things you brought up. Feel free to take a turn now, especially if there's anything I missed!

Download Endless Winter e6 (https://dl.dropbox.com/u/4353469/Nifforum%20-%20Endless%20Winter%20e6.knytt.bin) 20MB

Note: I didn't do a full playthrough before compressing like I usually do, so there could well be bugs.

Spoiler: Changes: (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on October 04, 2012, 02:39:50
Cool!  I'll be playing through this soon.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Ultigonio on October 21, 2012, 05:35:13
Hey guys!  I just wanted to drop in again and say that what you've put together so far is awesome.  I looking back at my old work, though--specifically, the music for the caves--and I thought I could probably make it a whole lot better and fitting to the feel of the level as a whole.  Is there anything in particular any of you might like me to adjust?  I'm thinking about changing the drums to not be quite so active, maybe slowing things down a little....
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on October 21, 2012, 09:53:01
I like it already, so I'm afraid I have no suggestions... but feel free to take another crack at it.

P.S. Someone should work on the level now.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on October 21, 2012, 23:27:04
Ultigonio, I like the music too. The way it is now, it gives the impression that you've entered an exciting area. Challenges are few in this level and they can be skipped. I would say it's very appropriate for the musical mood to change for these parts. However, I have no issue with you tweaking your own stuff.

I'm going to pester Healy and Headgrinder about finishing the level, since they both showed an interest. But if anyone is reading this and thinks they'd like to participate, then speak up.

*gives star* for Ultigonio's music!
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on October 23, 2012, 12:58:02
I'm super busy with variety of rl stuff right now, plus I'm obsessing about Submachine theories on the Pastel Forums right now.  So, I guess I'll bow out.  If I get free time, I'll pop back in, but I'm not expecting you to leave me anything.  :D
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Healy on October 26, 2012, 03:47:00
I think I might have to bow out too. I just don't have as many ideas for this that I thought I would. I do have a request for Lab 1 (more of a joke, really):
Spoiler: (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on October 26, 2012, 03:50:13
You should definitely upload what you made, I'm sure some of it could still be used!
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on November 11, 2012, 01:31:04
It looks like no one is going to take up the torch, so I'll finish the level. I'll add Healy's idea. Sergio, did you have an audio track or a musician in mind for cutscenes?
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: sergiocornaga on November 11, 2012, 02:18:42
Thanks for stepping up! I figured it would come to this. I have no music suggestions, other than that short Sion track I added as a kind of generic reading documents music, so take it in whatever direction you want,
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on November 11, 2012, 21:05:40
Not only have I been too busy, but we just had our little girl AND my laptop is currently dead, so thanks.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on November 12, 2012, 02:06:08
@ Headgrinder: Congratulations and sorry for your loss. I'd been avoiding lab 1 because I didn't know what to do with it, but while thinking over your designs in lab 4 lab 3 the solution finally hit me.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on November 22, 2012, 22:56:05
Thanks.  I'm trying to decide if I can justify buying a laptop during the blackfriday hell sale.  The only pc I have now is an old one I hooked to our TV.  Can't wait to see how you've wrapped everything up and sure wish I could have joined in.  I still have a vivid picture in my head of an underwater air pocket cave with an alter in it.  I could have sworn someone actually made it because it is so vivid, but I haven't found it in a single release of the game.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Firecat on November 22, 2012, 23:52:01
Apparently, the level has now been released (http://nifflas.lpchip.nl/index.php?topic=5648.0).
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Headgrinder on February 03, 2013, 03:12:40
I really enjoyed this project, even though it took us a year.  Would any one be interested in trying another one?
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: egomassive on February 03, 2013, 06:16:22
@^: There's something like a round-robin brewing in the hidden-star area of the forum. I'm sure it will move out into the open if it gets off the ground. It sounds like it would be your cup of tea Headgrinder.
Title: Re: KS Round Robin - Reloaded
Post by: Salmoneous on February 19, 2013, 15:42:15
@^: There's something like a round-robin brewing in the hidden-star area of the forum.

hidden-star area?  :O

We should get a new one started for sure. Since no news on auwa2 I would be on this.