Nifflas' Support Forum

Being Creative => Creativity Support => Topic started by: zakreepotts on August 15, 2010, 08:57:58

Title: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: zakreepotts on August 15, 2010, 08:57:58
I'm 13 and i have absolutely no experience in programing or anything else needed to do this. What all needs to be learned, and what should i start with?
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Evil on August 15, 2010, 10:04:59
You should start with google :)

No  :sick:

The maker that nifflas uses use that, and learn it :)

c4d has nice 3d stuff you can make, the price is very expensive 4000$ (or was it maya?)
they use those 3d things to make games :)

^Thats all I know I'm not sure about the rest. Wait for other people to reply :)
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: LPChip on August 15, 2010, 11:25:55
Nifflas uses MMF2. It has a good community and extensions to make good games, but it does cost money.

GameMaker is an alternative you can try that doesn't cost money (you can buy a license to get that gamemaker shareware version loader out of your game)

Or you can start learning to program. Knowing a programming language is actually very handy because it helps you understand any kind of building tool.

Perhaps you should just try out software like Dark Basic (which can be used to create games)
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: AClockworkLemon on August 15, 2010, 12:54:09
I'm 13 and i have absolutely no experience in programing or anything else needed to do this. What all needs to be learned, and what should i start with?

Recommending a game creation platform is a tricky thing...
Personally, i use and recommend Game Maker 8. It offers a simplistic UI (user interface), with drag & drop commands and simple creation tools, but has a powerful engine when you want to start coding. It doesn't take long to go from drag & drop to the coding at all.

I'm 16, and have been coding for 3 years. Personally, i would suggest practicing a bit of programming as well. It (at least for me) really feels good when you work out how to get past a bug/issue in what you are making. As for languages, i'm not very well read on game-making scripts, but something like HTML and JavaScript is a good place to get your head around things like common syntax and to get a bit of practice "behind the wheel" (that's where i started). Other good scripts are Visual Basic and Visual C# (http://www.microsoft.com/express/downloads/) - a bit of a learning curve, but not to drastic

....wow, i sure rambled on a bit there XD

P.S. welcome to the nifforum  C)p

Edit: hey, im not to busy ATM, so if you choose to use Game Maker, and need some help or assistance, send a PM and i'll b happy to help :D
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Purple Pineapple on August 15, 2010, 19:55:25
I recommend MMF2 (clickteam.com) unless you don't want to fork out too much money, In which case I suggest HTML 5.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Firewall on August 16, 2010, 01:22:17
A good launch pad for making a game is usualy Game Maker (I could be wrong). Although, some elements of it need the "PRO" edition of it, which would cost money, but you could still make alot of games.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: smeagle on August 16, 2010, 07:57:25
I was in the EXACT same situation as you last!

I started with Game maker.

Now, i don not believe it is very good, but it is VERY good for starting out.

It will sort of introduce you to concepts such as Functions, Variables and many other things.

I agree with everyone who said Game maker, as now, it has helped me learn many other things such as C.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Grookie on August 17, 2010, 14:13:47
I recommend GameMaker 8.
It is very simple and funny, but I had to find how to make platform games´ character.
Now, I have got 2 platform games created (my first), so you see, it is very easy (you can make one small game per day)
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Pumpkinbot on August 17, 2010, 20:04:49
Actually, if I were you, I'd start with something simple that requires no language, such as Knytt Stories' level editor, then slowly get into learning a language. If you want to make an RPG or sprite-based shooter or something like that, I'm currently dabbling in something called 001 Action/RPG Maker. (Google it if you're interested.)
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: AClockworkLemon on August 18, 2010, 03:16:17
Actually, if I were you, I'd start with something simple that requires no language, such as Knytt Stories' level editor, then slowly get into learning a language. If you want to make an RPG or sprite-based shooter or something like that, I'm currently dabbling in something called 001 Action/RPG Maker. (Google it if you're interested.)

Game Maker requires no scripting at all, if you want
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Yoeri on August 18, 2010, 16:02:44
Actually, if I were you, I'd start with something simple that requires no language, such as Knytt Stories' level editor, then slowly get into learning a language. If you want to make an RPG or sprite-based shooter or something like that, I'm currently dabbling in something called 001 Action/RPG Maker. (Google it if you're interested.)

Game Maker requires no scripting at all, if you want

While you can learn a lot of the scripting process with the drag and drop stuff.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: AClockworkLemon on August 19, 2010, 11:43:56
While you can learn a lot of the scripting process with the drag and drop stuff.

You most certainly can.


On a different Note, i have some more advice, not just to the OP, but to anyone interested.
I'm a Game Maker 8 User, and i plan on using using it to create games for the coming Ludum Dare, but i also have begun learning Visual C#, with XNA 3.1

I've found that it's quite a good carry-on from GM, if not a good startpoint, as the learning curve isn't too steep, but still poses a few challenges (good in my opinion), and there is heaps of tutorials and resources out there. oh, and it can also create both 2D and 3D games.

If you can wait, XNA 4 is in beta, and will be coming out soon, which you will be able to connect with Visual C# Express 2010 (or Visual Studio if you have the money), or you can start now with XNA 3.1 and VC# 2008.

All downloads are avaliable free :D
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Evil on August 22, 2010, 18:09:11
While you can learn a lot of the scripting process with the drag and drop stuff.
OP

What does OP mean? :)
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Yukabacera on August 22, 2010, 18:39:05
While you can learn a lot of the scripting process with the drag and drop stuff.
OP

What does OP mean? :)

Original poster.

=|=
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Evil on August 23, 2010, 12:17:42
While you can learn a lot of the scripting process with the drag and drop stuff.
OP

What does OP mean? :)


Original poster.

=|=

Isnt it disrespectful. You know his name yet you substitute a two letter phrase for it?  :huh:
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: AClockworkLemon on August 24, 2010, 05:39:49
Isnt it disrespectful. You know his name yet you substitute a two letter phrase for it?  :huh:

Oh come on, stop going on about it. I was feeling lazy, and OP is common(ish) internet slang. It's not disrespectful at all.

back on topic, another good start is FlashDevelop + either FlashPunk (i'm learning this one) or flixel
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Nifflas on August 29, 2010, 11:19:41
I like Multimedia Fusion 2. Basically, head to clickteam (http://www.clickteam.com) and grab a demo and read some of the tutorials at the website.

At the other hand, game maker (http://www.yoyogames.com/make) should not be underestimated. Spelunky (http://www.spelunkyworld.com/) and tuning (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ji-OPheJGdk&feature=player_embedded) was created in it. It's easy enough to get started with, and later when you get good and dig into scripting, you'll be able to create awesome things. Most indie developers uses middleware today anyway, I know several professional companies that chose Unity over C++.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: minmay on August 29, 2010, 18:27:31
I suggest that you learn a scripting language for an existing game that you like; knowing a scripting language will make learning a "real" programming language much easier.  Lua is a good choice.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: hugobros3 on August 30, 2010, 14:09:50
In my opinion , MMF2 is better than GM, it has toons of extension (and an c++ SDK !) , HWA , Online gaming easily and you can check ou the KS source with (ks source is really instructive).
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: jimj316 on August 30, 2010, 17:40:11
I wouldn't worry about being only 13 either, I learned MMF (1) at the age of seven, MMF2 at ten, and I am now 15.

MMF2 is a very good language for starting off, and is fairly powerful for such a simple product; however I doubt any software companies use it, so if you're looking at programming for a profession, I'd recommend learning a more widely-adopted language like C++ or Java. Don't abandon MMF2 completely though, as Clickteam is probably the only software company that isn't even slightly evil.

Whatever you choose, good luck and have fun in the world of programming!  :D
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Purple Pineapple on August 31, 2010, 01:07:25
MMF2 is a very good language for starting off, and is fairly powerful for such a simple product; however I doubt any software companies use it,
"I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?"
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: jimj316 on August 31, 2010, 20:26:23
MMF2 is a very good language for starting off, and is fairly powerful for such a simple product; however I doubt any software companies use it,
"I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?"
game=software
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Purple Pineapple on September 01, 2010, 03:35:47
MMF2 is a very good language for starting off, and is fairly powerful for such a simple product; however I doubt any software companies use it,
"I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?"
game=software
Ah.. no. Game. (http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=game) Software. (http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=software)
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: AClockworkLemon on September 01, 2010, 04:29:33
Ah.. no. Game. (http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=game) Software. (http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=software)
All games are software, hence game = software.
However,
NOT all software is a game, hence software != game.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Purple Pineapple on September 01, 2010, 04:47:32
All games are software, hence game = software.
Like football? :P I get what you're saying, though.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: vdweller on September 02, 2010, 09:54:50
I would suggest starting with Game Maker, trying to make something simple like an arkanoid clone using the drag&drop actions, then gradually replacing drag&drop actions with Game Maker's programming language (GML). Once you understand some "rules" of the program, eg in what order each event is performed, and with the help of some extensions, you will be unstoppable.


Of course, Multimedia Fusion also seems a very obvious choice, since some people, including Nifflas, have done great games with it.

PS there is no point arguing which tool is the best. I started making games in Visual Basic 6, which wasn't that bad, but it was definitely not THE tool for making games. But then, I started using Game Maker, and I realised that my accumulated knowledge from my VB6 days helped understand things a lot faster. So perhaps the most useful tool is your imagination. Everything else can be downloaded.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Nifflas on September 04, 2010, 16:57:17
Don't miss out Construct (http://www.scirra.com/). It does a lot of things right that Multimedia Fusion 2 does wrong. It's getting closer a 1.0 release, which means it's hopefully stable enough to rely on soon enough.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: TheDarkOne on September 08, 2010, 01:54:03
Python is a good one. I can recommend a good pdf for learning it, too. Expect linky-thingy.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: LPChip on September 08, 2010, 14:22:21
Don't miss out Construct (http://www.scirra.com/). It does a lot of things right that Multimedia Fusion 2 does wrong. It's getting closer a 1.0 release, which means it's hopefully stable enough to rely on soon enough.

I've recently (after reading this post) given Construct a go.

I've also tried MMF2 in the past and did the tutorial game with it. I found MMF2 rather hard and limited because it seems that for most functionality I want, I had to resort to plugins, not just what comes out of the box.

Construct is very cool with examples out of the box and stunning graphical effects. The release seems very stable, and even better, I was able to run and create games in a VMWare box (Virtual Box worked okay too, but less support for Direct3D). This means, I do not have to install Construct on my system at all, and I can test my own pc to see if I miss any dll's etc.

I might actually make one or more games with this. :)

I have a few ideas of games that I want to make. Oh and there are lots of videos about construct even. One video actually makes a Braid clone in under 5 minutes. Okay, it doesn't do much, and all graphics were already made, but still. You might also want to search for videos on the other platforms to see what kind of game they create and perhaps a tutorial or two.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: TheDarkOne on September 09, 2010, 00:34:15
I joined the Construct forum yesterday.

What I found:

A 3D FPS
A cool, non-violent, Nifflas-like, maze game
A tutorial on making a platformer

And MUCH more. Construct is what I've been looking for. LPChip has the right idea.

                                                         ... Still might try MMF2 though...
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Wanderer on September 09, 2010, 12:45:39
I highly recommend MMF for 2D it's easy to learn at first, and once you do it for about 6 months to a year you begin to understand it more. And can make pretty cool looking games with it.

Though the 'fo' 3D (like Wolfenstein) can be done with MMF it's pretty hard.

I might look into Construct for make an FPS (FPS Creator is stupid) even if Construct 3D is 'fo' 3D, I still like the style of it.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: LPChip on September 09, 2010, 14:26:20
Could you enlighten the 'fo' thingy? The only thing I can come up with, what this could mean is a swear word, and that seems not to be the case, as it doesn't fit the context.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Wanderer on September 09, 2010, 20:47:32
'Fo' as in fake.

Oh I think I spelled it wrong. I think it's actually spelled 'faux,' I just spelled it phonetically. :P


EDIT: Grammar mistake
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: LPChip on September 09, 2010, 21:13:08
I see. Neither fo or faux is known to me. Thanks for giving me the 'translation' :P
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: TheDarkOne on September 13, 2010, 03:03:34
Can we shift the topic from grammatical mistakes to programming? Thank you.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Wanderer on September 13, 2010, 03:28:39
I do believe you have gotten sufficient answers TDO.

And I do believe grammar is very important and any mistakes should be resolved. Thank you.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Whistler on October 02, 2010, 14:58:51
Gamemaker is great for beginners, I use it.

EDIT: I posted this before seeing what people were talking about. Noob mistake.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Ultigonio on October 04, 2010, 01:24:15
Game Maker, by comparison to say, C++, is fantastic for beginners.  If you're going to do anything particularly interesting in it, though, you'll need to have a good grasp on math up to Algebra.  After reviewing a list of the mathematical formulas you can use in it, I found that it goes all the way up to Calculus (or at least precal).  The more math you know (particularly in actual application and understanding, not just simple formula-knowing), the more you can code and the more effectively you can do so.
It's also helpful if you're good at catching on.  And always be sure you know what you're coding into your game when you copying codes.

The one thing about GML is that it's slow, and when you get in to real, big-league coding, much of the coding won't be nearly as direct or easy to understand as GML (I coded an extremely simple name-return and yes-no answering program in C++, it took about an hour on my first shot, and I only understood about 3/4 of what I was using).  On the other hand, GML WILL help you understand many of the very important basics, such as if-then statements (which a fully programmed game would probably have at least several hundred of), variables (can go from one hundred to a few hundred, depending), how to be efficient and organized with your coding, and the uses of math for various effects and ideas.

I haven't looked at Construct, though....  I'll do that soon, I think.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: SecretGlitch on October 04, 2010, 02:55:50
While you can learn a lot of the scripting process with the drag and drop stuff.

You most certainly can.


On a different Note, i have some more advice, not just to the OP, but to anyone interested.
I'm a Game Maker 8 User, and i plan on using using it to create games for the coming Ludum Dare, but i also have begun learning Visual C#, with XNA 3.1

I've found that it's quite a good carry-on from GM, if not a good startpoint, as the learning curve isn't too steep, but still poses a few challenges (good in my opinion), and there is heaps of tutorials and resources out there. oh, and it can also create both 2D and 3D games.

If you can wait, XNA 4 is in beta, and will be coming out soon, which you will be able to connect with Visual C# Express 2010 (or Visual Studio if you have the money), or you can start now with XNA 3.1 and VC# 2008.

All downloads are avaliable free :D

Oh hey, ACWL, I didn't know there was another XNA user here! But yeah, for anyone that's strong in programming, XNA is definitely a clean and easy platform to code your own game. I started with learning C++ and Java, and the transition to C# and XNA was nearly seamless for me.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: TheDarkOne on October 04, 2010, 03:42:44
I can't get the XNA thing 'cuz I don't have one of those pesky WinLive things.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: GrayFace on October 23, 2010, 06:20:06
My first impressions from MMF2: stay a mile away from it. No debug, painful limited programming and even no way to paste a part of code from an older version, because groups activation/deactivation gets messed up. How Nifflas managed to make his games in it is a miracle.
I suggest C# as the language.
Love2D is also interesting, because there you do everything in Lua, it may be good for a start, but it doesn't seem serious enough and I haven't heard of any other Lua-only solutions.

Edit: By "No debug" in MMF2 I meant no breakpoints, at least I haven't found anything like that.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: AClockworkLemon on October 23, 2010, 09:06:29
Well, i've found my new home in game dev.

I'd seriously try out Flash. Like, seriously. There's a lot of support, plus it's available for pretty much any platform (excluding iOS in part :/)
Although making a gave in straight Flash is hard, if you use a library, it's way easier. Have a look at FlashPunk or Flixel (i'd suggest flashpunk, it has better collision detection).

Plus, all the resources are free. FlashPunk/Flixel are opensources, as is FlashDevelop (what you code in)

FlashBuilder by adobe costs a bit, so i'd stick to flashdevelop.

Thinking about gam dev, you might want to check out my website and twitter, i've linked them in my sig
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: TheDarkOne on October 23, 2010, 23:41:15
If you want to see what flash can do, check out this program:

http://www.mediafire.com/?2jldmfqywyb (http://www.mediafire.com/?2jldmfqywyb)

http://fallingsandgame.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=8096 (http://fallingsandgame.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=8096)

It's a sand game test.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: GrayFace on October 26, 2010, 09:29:52
If you mean http://www.falling-sand-game.com/ , it's a Java program.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Wanderer on October 27, 2010, 12:23:25
So far I think I've heard XNA can do 3D games. But if anyone here develops 3D games, what do you use?

I love 2D, but a lot of my ideas are better done in a third dimension.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: AClockworkLemon on October 27, 2010, 14:11:19
So far I think I've heard XNA can do 3D games. But if anyone here develops 3D games, what do you use?

I love 2D, but a lot of my ideas are better done in a third dimension.

XNA can indeed do 3D. As can GameMaker (but is very limited). Just remember that the extra dimension quadruples the amount of work.

If i'm fiddling around with 3D, i use Unity3D3 (version 3, that is). Just google unity.
It's powerful, and has a nice interface. Oh, and it's free, as long as you can stand the splash screen and a few missing functions. You can alo purchase packs that allow you to develop for iPhone, Wii and i think android is coming out soon
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Wanderer on October 30, 2010, 05:43:24
Yeah I've heard of Unity.

Does it require any prior programming experience?
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: AClockworkLemon on October 30, 2010, 06:13:13
Yeah I've heard of Unity.

Does it require any prior programming experience?
a bit.

You have a choice as to which language you code in though, and there is heaps of support. It includes stuff like javascript, so it shouldn't be too much of a worry
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: Wanderer on October 30, 2010, 18:54:05
Is it compatible with normal Java? That's what I'm learning right now. :P
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: AClockworkLemon on October 31, 2010, 00:35:38
Not a clue. i'll boot up my copy and take a look.

OK.
Unity supports the following programming languages' syntax (obviously Unity usues the script itself differently):
JavaScript
C#
Boo
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: TheDarkOne on October 31, 2010, 02:01:41
If you mean http://www.falling-sand-game.com/ , it's a Java program.

Aah. No. I mean THAT GAME RIGHT THERE, not what you said.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: GrayFace on November 01, 2010, 12:01:04
Your link http://fallingsandgame.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=8096 doesn't work.
Title: Re: I want to learn how to make a game. Where do i start?
Post by: TheDarkOne on November 06, 2010, 18:51:45
It does for me.

And BTW, it's just the flash TEST that's Flash.