I'm kind of stuck.
I got the eye at the top of the mountain, but now I'm not sure what to do. I tried going inside the mountain and ended up at a screen where the only option was to climb the mountain again, this time from the left side. I did that, with much difficulty due to various challenges, but that accomplished nothing. So, did I miss something on my way up, or did I take a wrong turn when I tried descending back into the mountain? I'd figure things out myself but the many challenges are kind of not making me very enthusiastic about the prospect :)
On the bright side, it's easier than I first thought. I could do with a few more savepoints after hard challenges, and maybe less dead ends, but people who are into hard levels are better judges than me.
Glad you're enjoying it.
A long way up the left side there is a passage that leads back into the mountain, a little way below the save point. You have to go in there, jump over the pit and slip past the ghost madusa woman thing (if you look away from her, she fades away again.
I hope that helps. Sorry about the confusingness :/ That's another thing I'll change for the version 2. At first I was a little cautious of the ghost women 'cus it took me a long time to work out how to pass them and didn't know if other people would, but in the end I got carried away and used them quite a lot. But they're easy to get past once you know how.
As for save points, my only defence is to say that I put in more than some people. But I guess the challenge-seems-easier-because-of-practice syndrome kicks in again.
That did help, thanks! I forgot all about the way to avoid the shadow woman and thought that passage was sealed. I got through to the part where you travel to various locations such as the sandy world and the bee hive
, at which point I had to kind of stop, because the difficulty was becoming too much for me - not that the challenges were too much, but simply the fact that you can spend a lot of time and effort on going somewhere only to find out it's a dead end... then spend a lot of time and effort going back, and then, well, you get the point.
Still, a lot of potential there, and very nice to see such variety and complex ideas in a first level. I hope you make another someday, maybe something smaller? ;)
I have another in the works. It's less of a maze, if nothing else :P Depends if I have enough motivation/ideas to bring it together. I'm being a bit more ambitious with this (technically and story-wise) but I won't say too much.
And if you want to know which order to visit the worlds in, this will get you started.
Bee hive, cave, desert, bee hive, floaty umbrella place. There's an item you need to get in each before moving on to the next. Try to remember the different key-holes you see in each place so that you know where to go when you get the keys. Each world has a keyhole each. Maybe write them down. The hologram is of use in the cave.
Yeah, I might provide some clues for that in the version 2.
By then you should have the codes from everywhere except the castle roofs.
You're doing really well!
*Talps is encouraged that someone is close to finishing his level*
In the desert if you meet ghosts instead of pyramid there should be a save point on the way back, in the screen x969y1006.
The way up in x999y1016 is too unclear.
The background is too dark in lava screens like that. It's very hard to distinguish background from walls.
Save point is needed at x1001y1017.
Screens x999y1020 - x997y1020 are very annoying.
Save point is needed after ninjas of x992y991.
In x990y990 there's no need for these random flying things. They aren't fun in any way.
You also overuse invisible spikes and other unexpected things.
Before you press the switch in the Beast Heart room you can climb up and get to wallswim.
Oh, and very nice level! :)
Hey, I finished this yesterday. It was a fun level with lots of nice challenges.
I liked the hub, although at times trekking to and from it was something of a chore. Maybe put in a series of teleporters that open up gradually as the game progresses? I'm thinking specifically of the two points where you reach a keyhole-blocked dead end and find a key for a seperate area, then have to backtrack all the way to the hub.
Also, I think a few sections seemed somewhat unfair and luck-based, like the blind trap-avoiding maze in the pyramid, and the bit with all the red flyers when leaving the castle
.
Oh, and, I found a wallswim. Inside the pyramid, just before the blind trap maze, you can climb up from the save point and wallswim up into the room with the water pit
Still, I really enjoyed playing it, and hope to play more of your levels soon :)
Quarantine with two toddlers has driven me to insane lengths. Deep enough to delve into Talps' very first level............ resurrected here over 10 years later. This is probably the second or third time I've played it, other times were many years ago. Apparently the author disowned it, since it no longer appears in Talps' signature. Rightfully so, as this lunatic-level challenge is completely unfair at its best. C)p
I found myself cursing that name several times, which I'll mention here specifically in case the author or anyone else is masochistic enough to relive this challenge.
x1001,y1018: having no idea where the spiky tombstones makes an otherwise challenging puzzle downright impossible on the first few runthroughs, and there's no save nearby.
x997,y1017: as far as I can tell, this jump is impossible unless you do the tricky put-the-umbrella-away-before-the-double-jump which is very difficult on my crappy 2-key rollover laptop keyboard.
x9991020-x997: Three screens with with the most erratic, unfair monsters, and no save points because apparently Talps hates his players. :P
x971y1006: Three fires shooting at you from all sides, without any ability to dodge, and a hidden maze so you don't even know where you -can- dodge.
x971y1008-y1010: You complete a really difficult challenge avoiding 8 shooty fires, only to drop down into an instant-death screen with no way to save or avoid, except through trial and error.
x993y991-x991y990: The spike masher room is just... I mean look at it. There's no "safe zone" and I found myself believing it to be legitimately impossible the first two dozen times I did it. Plus I kept dying to the ninja-monkeys or the waterfall jump every other respawn which just made it extra frustrating, having no save right before the nigh-impossible sceen. Then you get through all that, only to die to some random erratic red guys just before you can save.
Finding the secret ending... never did. Even with the level editor, finding the way through that maze is borderline impossible.
Having to backtrack to each area 2-3 times with different items/keys to unlock doors.
Having said ALL of that, I really enjoyed playing through the level for a few reasons:
-For one, it's great seeing this early level and knowing how far both Talps and the community standards in general have come in story, pacing, and level design between this and later levels.
-It's also interesting to see some of the things the community has lost over the years.
----It used to be a common trope to have the player go through screens normally and then get the eye and have a different set of challenges to overcome going the other way. I like that mechanic, and it's done particularly well here in the Mining Mountain section. Areas suddenly because much easier or much harder with/without the eye.
----Backtracking used to be much more common, and I think it's a mixed bag. Sometimes its fun to go through an area already completed with a new power and just kind of blow through the challenges like an acrobat goddess and other times it feels like a chore to have to redo something you've already completed.
-I enjoyed the beehive quite a bit. One of the few beehives done well in various KS.
-Most of the areas actually were really fun. It's an enormous level, and the unfair areas were only a small percentage.
-The Heart of the Machine had appropriate difficulties in terms of challenges.
I honestly feel a sense of accomplishment having beaten this BEAST without cheating. It's probably the 2nd or 3rd hardest level I've played. (Deep Sea 2 being #1)
Hope to see more from this promising upstart of a KS level designer! C)p
Search for one secret room in each zone. I'd say the most 'obvious' one is given away by one of the cats in the beehive.
Quarantine with two toddlers has driven me to insane lengths. Deep enough to delve into Talps' very first level............ resurrected here over 10 years later. This is probably the second or third time I've played it, other times were many years ago. Apparently the author disowned it, since it no longer appears in Talps' signature. Rightfully so, as this lunatic-level challenge is completely unfair at its best. C)p
Thanks for softening the blow there, friend. I didn't ask you to play my disowned, orphaned, unloved, out-in-the-cold-where-there-is-groaning-and-gnashing-of-teeth firstborn level, you know.
Fun fact: those first few screens where you're hopping around on pillars and collecting all of the jump upgrades were literally the first screens I ever made as I taught myself to use the editor.
Talps top tip: Using the first screens you ever made when teaching yourself to use the editor as the opening as an epic-length super level is a great way of setting the tone for your players! Anyone who plays past that point either has Half-Life-series-protagonist-level stubbornness issues, or is a masochist!
x1001,y1018: having no idea where the spiky tombstones makes an otherwise challenging puzzle downright impossible on the first few runthroughs, and there's no save nearby.
Something you have to do is a designer is remember the player doesn't know everything you know. I hadn't figured this out when I made this screen.
x997,y1017: as far as I can tell, this jump is impossible unless you do the tricky put-the-umbrella-away-before-the-double-jump which is very difficult on my crappy 2-key rollover laptop keyboard.
Talps Productions accepts no liability for any injuries, stress or stress-related illness caused by the limitations of the player's selected hardware.
x9991020-x997: Three screens with with the most erratic, unfair monsters, and no save points because apparently Talps hates his players. :P
To this day, I... I like the snowball monsters. Listen my friend; when you like an enemy, the appropriate thing to do is shove as many of them into a series of screens as you can without making the challenge actually impossible.
I should start a protest outside your zoo.
x971y1006: Three fires shooting at you from all sides, without any ability to dodge, and a hidden maze so you don't even know where you -can- dodge.
...Ok, yeah, fair enough.
x971y1008-y1010: You complete a really difficult challenge avoiding 8 shooty fires, only to drop down into an instant-death screen with no way to save or avoid, except through trial and error.
Cf. comment on first complaint.
x993y991-x991y990: The spike masher room is just... I mean look at it. There's no "safe zone" and I found myself believing it to be legitimately impossible the first two dozen times I did it. Plus I kept dying to the ninja-monkeys or the waterfall jump every other respawn which just made it extra frustrating, having no save right before the nigh-impossible sceen. Then you get through all that, only to die to some random erratic red guys just before you can save.
Another fun fact: when I navigated to this screen to check out what you were whining about* I started humming one of the KS default music tracks, and was pleasantly surprised to realise when I checked that I was actually unconsciously humming the music that plays in those screens! And that is all I have to say about that!
Finding the secret ending... never did. Even with the level editor, finding the way through that maze is borderline impossible.
DonDoli did not find the secret ending on his playthrough. But he did find the secret that signposts the secrets that lead to the secret ending (https://youtu.be/6ENtbAvPSSQ?t=4349)!
Having to backtrack to each area 2-3 times with different items/keys to unlock doors.
But that's part of the fun! (Talps said as he shovelled money into a duffel bag, shortly before legging it towards the Mexican border.)
:P2
-For one, it's great seeing this early level and knowing how far both Talps and the community standards in general have come in story, pacing, and level design between this and later levels.
Well, at least I can be a bad example!
-It's also interesting to see some of the things the community has lost over the years.
----It used to be a common trope to have the player go through screens normally and then get the eye and have a different set of challenges to overcome going the other way. I like that mechanic, and it's done particularly well here in the Mining Mountain section. Areas suddenly because much easier or much harder with/without the eye.
----Backtracking used to be much more common, and I think it's a mixed bag. Sometimes its fun to go through an area already completed with a new power and just kind of blow through the challenges like an acrobat goddess and other times it feels like a chore to have to redo something you've already completed.
Both of these are features in 'The Machine' and 'A Strange Dream' so I think they carried over when a lot of players turned designer (and is similar to the reason why there are several levels about turning off machines. Ahem). That is definitely the right way to use the Eye in my opinion, but not at all the easiest thing to design. If I ever finish my latest project, you might appreciate my eye-section.
-I enjoyed the beehive quite a bit. One of the few beehives done well in various KS.
Thanks! As I recall, I was digging through the default tilesets (because there was no way I was gonna design my own. As if!) and I saw it and I thought, 'What if there was an area in my amazing first level where Juni inexplicably shrinks and goes inside a beehive?' True story! The next time a tileset inspired me to make an area in a level like that, the result was the entirety of 'Dragon Myth'.
-Most of the areas actually were really fun. It's an enormous level, and the unfair areas were only a small percentage.
How did you keep a straight face while typing that?
-The Heart of the Machine had appropriate difficulties in terms of challenges.
Ahh, I think what happened there was you typed 'appropriate difficulties' when you meant to type 'excruciating difficulties'.
Yup, definitely a masochist.
Thanks. :)
Oriane, glad you had fun, too! (And nice username!)
*Kidding!
EDIT:
x993y991-x991y990: The spike masher room is just... I mean look at it. There's no "safe zone" and I found myself believing it to be legitimately impossible the first two dozen times I did it. Plus I kept dying to the ninja-monkeys or the waterfall jump every other respawn which just made it extra frustrating, having no save right before the nigh-impossible sceen. Then you get through all that, only to die to some random erratic red guys just before you can save.
I just tried it and did it on my first attempt.
:D
x993y991-x991y990: The spike masher room is just... I mean look at it. There's no "safe zone" and I found myself believing it to be legitimately impossible the first two dozen times I did it. Plus I kept dying to the ninja-monkeys or the waterfall jump every other respawn which just made it extra frustrating, having no save right before the nigh-impossible sceen. Then you get through all that, only to die to some random erratic red guys just before you can save.
I just tried it and did it on my first attempt.
:D
Really? What is the appropriate strategy here? Can you upload a video of how you approach it? I think I just fumbled through it and eventually got lucky. I feel like there has to be some secret, because I just played through Dark Sea (a comparative walk in the park, really), and now I'm playing through Peppyhare4000's Salvation, which, while difficult, I don't think there's any single room I've encountered yet that I consider to be as difficult as that masher room.
If I ever finish my latest project, you might appreciate my eye-section.
Intriguing! Is that Liangzhu, or something else?
DonDoli did not find the secret ending on his playthrough. But he did find the secret that signposts the secrets that lead to the secret ending!
I may go back and try and find them, then. If my toddlers decide to have another screaming match, that is.
What if there was an area in my amazing first level where Juni inexplicably shrinks and goes inside a beehive?
You know what? I've come up with a sort of headcanon for why the keys are where they are.
The BEAST machine, like all complicated machines, was built by intelligent and thoughtful life forms. They were intelligent enough to create a machine of unimaginable power and complexity, one that could traverse space and terraform entire worlds, paving the way for future habitation by its builders. It would grow and adapt to new challenges, learning to navigate even the harshest environments. The builders were thoughtful enough to provide a failsafe; deep inside the BEAST's circuitry was a hardcoded directive, stating it must provide an accessible shutdown mechanism to allow sentient life to disable it. They never meant to terraform inhabited worlds, after all!
The builders miscalculated, a bit. Their short-lived minds, thinking in timescales of minutes or hours or years simply could not anticipate how the BEAST would evolve in its aeons-long journey across dozens of worlds. They never could have predicted that the cold, uncaring, algorithmic evolution would be guided more by its redundant layers of self-preservation directives than any of its other hardcoded goals. As it evolved to survive, the BEAST layered the failsafe mechanism in nearly impenetrable security measures. But a machine must obey its programming, and a hardcoded directive must be followed, and so the failsafe mechanism, however difficult to access, was still accessible.
The BEAST locked away its failsafe and hid the only access codes all across the planet. Sure, a driven individual could still access the codes, at least according to some models. Part of the code was hidden deep in the crust of the planet, far below the surface, near the molten mantle. Another was hidden in the last chamber at the very bottom of a long lost, ancient underwater temple. Still another was locked away and hidden at the heart of the strongest fortress ever constructed. The final piece of the code was hidden through anonymity: the BEAST selected at random one unimportant agriculture site among the many millions maintained by the planet population. Who would think to check there, in a beehive of all places, for access codes to the world-destroying terraforming machine?
This also explains why it keeps Juni's comrades alive as ghosts. It's not allowed to actually kill any sentient life, so it merely de-materializes them and keeps them "alive," suspended as ethereal holographic brainwave patterns.
Well that ballooned into more than the two sentences I originally thought it would be. Maybe someday it will published in "The Coming of the Dark: Secret Origins!" graphic novel. XD