Nifflas' Support Forum
Released Games => Knytt Underground => Topic started by: Wrenbot on March 31, 2014, 00:56:18
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While the single-screen view works great in Knytt Underground and lets adjacent locations have a distinct look and feel, continuous scrolling (as in Terraria) would give a better sense of exploration and scope of a huge world, specially if you added some parallax effects for a sense of depth with multiple layers of those gorgeous photorealistic backgrounds. ;)
Is the flick-screen a conscious design choice that you're going to use in all of your games, or was it more a result of saving development time and map editing costs?
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I can't speak for Nifflas but I know that in the past he liked it a lot because it gives a much better transition between two areas and makes it feel less like separate area's because you go from screen to screen all the time. Also, in the past it was a limitation that MMF2 had. So maybe things have changed now he uses Unity and works with 3D more.
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The teaser for Affordable Space Adventures shows seamless scrolling. Perhaps he's gonna stop doing the flippy transition thing from that game onward.
However, in Saira and Knytt Experiment, there's scrolling and the flippy screen thing at the same time, so ASA can also be like that.
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Also, in the past it was a limitation that MMF2 had.
For some games this may be the case, but with Knytt I think I recall that seamless scrolling was possible and Nifflas consciously opted for screen-based level design because it offered more control over the visual composition at any one point. But I can't find any evidence of such a post here... perhaps my memory should not be trusted.
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Ah yeah, but Knytt didn't have a level editor. The entire level was made inside MMF2.
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Nifflas consciously opted for screen-based level design because it offered more control over the visual composition at any one point.
This is what I thought. In KU there are areas next to each with completely different backgrounds and lighting etc which is possible because of the flick-screen design.
In a continuous-scrolling view it probably would've required a lot of "filler" space to let the background have a smooth transition from one "theme" to another, but it also would've made the world feel a lot bigger which is why I hope Nifflas uses it in his future games!
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It is still possible to make one larger room with the same background, and then some smaller rooms with different backgrounds. So you still have the flip-screen based design but with larger scrolling rooms. But it'll be harder to create a level editor for such games.
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All I can say is that everything will change now. New platform, new possibilities and new limitations. I've built my own advanced sequencer in Unity which I can compose music in that reacts to things that happen in a game (I used this in 7 Nanocycles, but that was a relatively quick and simple experiment, it can follow the gameplay in way more dynamic and interesting ways), and I'm getting okay at 3D modelling and will learn some animation soon. Right now I'm working full time on Affordable Space Adventures, and have no specific plans for after that (though loads of different ideas to pick from). One thing that's certain however is that my games will look and feel quite different in the future as most of my ideas are various types of 3D worlds.
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Sounds awesome :) But I hope you won't break up with 2D as well.
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Not in the long run, I'll definitely return to 2D, but for now I want to go wild and try things that are completely new to me. I'm super excited that I can finally do all these interactive things with music, so that will probably have a big impact.
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I'm super excited that I can finally do all these interactive things with music, so that will probably have a big impact.
And oh man I just LOVE your music! You may be surprised but my favorite piece is the music that plays at the Fairy Springs. It's actually been stuck in my head. Short but beautiful, and it follows up nicely on the tune from the previous area. I have to leave the game on and go back and forth between the areas so I can keep listening to it in the wonderful ambience created by the scenery. :P2
Can't wait to hear more from you!
One thing that's certain however is that my games will look and feel quite different in the future as most of my ideas are various types of 3D worlds.
I just hope you realize that you may be on to a whole new genre of games here: I've been playing since the Sinclair ZX Spectrum but I can't remember a 2D platformer with such a large world and so many NPCs and stories, with twitch-movement puzzles but no pesky combat to distract from the adventure. The exodus to 3D during the '90s actually turned me off from gaming for a while, until they could actually look and play better than 2D (which is still rare in the case of platform games, I mean 3D worlds not 3D graphics.)
I'm still gonna be eagerly looking forward to your future games, and hope you let us wander the Underground again one day. C)
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I feel the same about the early 3D games in the 90's. I think the key to why it failed was that the graphics tried to look realistic, despite that the technology just wasn't there. Even when it comes to today's 3D graphics, I think games that try to be realistic will be forgotten since the future will obviously have way better hardware, where stylized 3D games like Journey or Shelter will be remembered as beautiful gems forever.
I'm obviously not going to go for a realistic style. Besides that I'm not interested in it, I don't have the resources to pull it off well. Whatever I do will probably be quite simple for a while until I get better with making shaders, but I'm getting a very good hang of 3D vectors and math now, and can already do nicely moving characters (well, I got tons of practice in Affordable Space Adventures even most of it is 2D...ish, but that ship is complicated stuff).